The JvS thread

[Thrillhouse]

Club retweeting idiots tweets that say they're proud of the team and the season we've had

wtf is wrong with people

[belaguttman]

 

 

 

My fear isn't that JVS is a terrible coach but that he's a mediocre one.

This. If we want another season of mediocrity then retain a mediocre coach. If we want to win something, hire a winner

[Jestr]

If the club keeps this muppet for next season I will be seriously pissed off and will have to re-assess my commitment to the cause for the duration of his stay in charge.

GTFO

[raw10]

Surely there is someone within Manchester City FC who knows the style of play that CFG wants us to play, could be enticed to come to Melbourne as a stepping stone to move up the ladder and  potentially manage Manchester City one day?

[Baka1]

Get out of my club. And never return. Not even in 2 years time. Never.

Btw throw the cheque book at Guus Hiddink if he hasn't retired

[belaguttman]

Guus hasn't retired, he's coaching the Netherlands national team

[Dylan]

Surely there is someone within Manchester City FC who knows the style of play that CFG wants us to play, could be enticed to come to Melbourne as a stepping stone to move up the ladder and  potentially manage Manchester City one day?

 

 

Viera 

[Thrillhouse]

 

Surely there is someone within Manchester City FC who knows the style of play that CFG wants us to play, could be enticed to come to Melbourne as a stepping stone to move up the ladder and  potentially manage Manchester City one day?

 

 

Viera 

 

5/1 equal 2nd favourite on skybet to be next permanent man city manager with benitez and ancelotti

klopp 6/4 favourite 

[charlibub]

I'd bring Vierra over JVS any day. No brainer. Where do I sign?

[Young Polak]

"John van't Schip and his coaching staff and football manager, John Didulica, who oversees recruiting and list management, will remain, but they will be bolstered by another layer of administration in the football management structure."

http://www.theage.com.au/sport/soccer/ruthless-melbourne-city-set-for-major-offseason-changes-20150509-ggxu6m.html





 

Edited May 10, 2015 by Young Polak

[raw10]

"John van't Schip and his coaching staff and football manager, John Didulica, who oversees recruiting and list management, will remain, but they will be bolstered by another layer of administration in the football management structure."

http://www.theage.com.au/sport/soccer/ruthless-melbourne-city-set-for-major-offseason-changes-20150509-ggxu6m.html

 

Hope this is NOT true!! We can have an all stars team in the league but if we play them out of position, what good would that do?! CFG you are barking mad!

[Victards]

Mods, 2015-16 Edition please. All positive, but this... Fucking bullshit!!

Edited May 10, 2015 by Victards

[charlibub]

FFS CFG SACK JVS PLEASE

[kingofhearts]

Glad we're keeping him! I think with a really good off season and a couple of signing s we can win the league!

He did take the team to finish in there highest ever position in club history you know?

[japiedog]

 

we lost the semi final to Victory in pretty much the way that Heart / City have played for the past 5 years

 

lots of possession, plenty of shots on goal, don't score, defensive lapses, concede cheap goals, lose

 

who has been the thread through almost all of that time, JVS

 

it doesn't matter what cattle we have had on the paddock, we have not been up to the task .

 

JVS out

 

 

 

[Jestr]

What did you expect.

With finals he finished in 4th place. Respectable position in the first year under cfg.

According to who? Them of course.

But it's not his first year in this club you idiots!!!!!!!

He had more than ample time to stamp his authority on the team.

Get ready for more of the same shit next year.

[Portillo]

Surely not.

[cadete]

I have said it before but we should target an UK Manager with extensive experience at a number of clubs... someone who has worked with a lot different personalities and deploying a number of different playing styles.

 

JVS clearly has issues relating to his players some of his relationships clearly reaching breaking point, with the A-League's small lists has always been an hindrance. There is a long list of blokes now who played for JVS at Heart/City who clearly dont like him and seems Erik has joined their ranks from his recent comments in the media.

 

Another thing JVS has never shown is an ability to shape a game plan/structure around his particular squad or the league itself which yet another thing that a club needs to do in the A-League due to the league's particularities. 

 

I dont care if we get a bloke who has playing us boring football as long as its winning us game... I say it over and over again but I would take a dour Steve over a flamboyant Mark Waugh any day of the week because at the end of day all that matters is results.

Edited May 12, 2015 by cadete

[Tesla]

Pretty much agree with Cad, there are two fairly obvious issues with JVS, he lacks adaptability and his man management is poor. The former is why we sometime go on good runs but can never sustain it, and the latter is why players come to the club with a decent pedigree and then turn to shit.

Honestly I don't know why JVS just doesn't focus on what he does best, youth development. Find a cushy youth coach job at a big European club with a fixed system and where results aren't important as long as the players develop. Surely being a crap first team manager in Australia and Mexico isn't any better.

[Peter]

But he's Dutch?!

[NewConvert]

I have said it before but we should target an UK Manager with extensive experience at a number of clubs... someone who has worked with a lot different personalities and deploying a number of different playing styles.

 

JVS clearly has issues relating to his players some of his relationships clearly reaching breaking point, with the A-League's small lists has always been an hindrance. There is a long list of blokes now who played for JVS at Heart/City who clearly dont like him and seems Erik has joined their ranks from his recent comments in the media.

 

Another thing JVS has never shown is an ability to shape a game plan/structure around his particular squad or the league itself which yet another thing that a club needs to do in the A-League due to the league's particularities. 

 

I dont care if we get a bloke who has playing us boring football as long as its winning us game... I say it over and over again but I would take a dour Steve over a flamboyant Mark Waugh any day of the week because at the end of day all that matters is results.

 

Why do they have to be from the UK (Scotland, England, Wales, Northern Ireland)? After all UK clubs and players are not setting the football world on fire. Neither Chelsea nor Man City are coached by someone originating from the UK. Additionally, these kind of coaches tend to go shopping every transfer window because they don't have salary caps, something that may hinder their style when they come to Oz. Oh, yeah Magilton fits your description and he was not a raging success at MV.

 

I do agree that a manager must have enjoyed some success with different teams. By its very nature coaching a number of clubs over a number of seasons will have exposed them to different personalities. I will caution though that both Sir Alex Ferguson and Ange don't give a rats about the players personality (and neither does Pep Guardiola).

 

Speaking of the aforementioned coaches, they don't care whether they are liked. They are there to get together a team that will play a game of football. The bigger question is whether the coaches are respected. If players don't respect their coach it won't be a happy club - witness the Jets' Stubbins vs the five players. As far as Erik's comments are concerned Murfy did point out that the full interview did not deviate from what JvS had said earlier.

 

I will disagree that JVS doesn't shape the game plan to fit the side. He did that just last season when he took over from JA. He experimented a lot during the first five games with formations and players. What annoys me is that this season he did not do that until the very end. So he can do it. I suspect that the reason why did not change all that much earlier in the season was because he was trying to instil a game plan into the side but that failed. Now one possible reason as to why that happened was because of the constant injury issues that the club has had and therefore it did not come off. Another reason maybe that it was predictable game plan. Or perhaps because the players did not buy it. Or a combination of the three plus more.

 

My reasons for losing faith in JVS are that at times the players did not show up - which indicate that he has lost them to some extent. he persisted with some players for far too long and he did not experiment enough during the season. He did so at the end but for me that was too late.

 

Do I want a team playing boring football but winning? I'll reluctantly take that. Much prefer a winning and exciting team but that will also mean that the player clean out continues.

[cadete]

 

I have said it before but we should target an UK Manager with extensive experience at a number of clubs... someone who has worked with a lot different personalities and deploying a number of different playing styles.

 

JVS clearly has issues relating to his players some of his relationships clearly reaching breaking point, with the A-League's small lists has always been an hindrance. There is a long list of blokes now who played for JVS at Heart/City who clearly dont like him and seems Erik has joined their ranks from his recent comments in the media.

 

Another thing JVS has never shown is an ability to shape a game plan/structure around his particular squad or the league itself which yet another thing that a club needs to do in the A-League due to the league's particularities. 

 

I dont care if we get a bloke who has playing us boring football as long as its winning us game... I say it over and over again but I would take a dour Steve over a flamboyant Mark Waugh any day of the week because at the end of day all that matters is results.

 

Why do they have to be from the UK (Scotland, England, Wales, Northern Ireland)? After all UK clubs and players are not setting the football world on fire. Neither Chelsea nor Man City are coached by someone originating from the UK. Additionally, these kind of coaches tend to go shopping every transfer window because they don't have salary caps, something that may hinder their style when they come to Oz. Oh, yeah Magilton fits your description and he was not a raging success at MV.

 

I do agree that a manager must have enjoyed some success with different teams. By its very nature coaching a number of clubs over a number of seasons will have exposed them to different personalities. I will caution though that both Sir Alex Ferguson and Ange don't give a rats about the players personality (and neither does Pep Guardiola).

 

Speaking of the aforementioned coaches, they don't care whether they are liked. They are there to get together a team that will play a game of football. The bigger question is whether the coaches are respected. If players don't respect their coach it won't be a happy club - witness the Jets' Stubbins vs the five players. As far as Erik's comments are concerned Murfy did point out that the full interview did not deviate from what JvS had said earlier.

 

I will disagree that JVS doesn't shape the game plan to fit the side. He did that just last season when he took over from JA. He experimented a lot during the first five games with formations and players. What annoys me is that this season he did not do that until the very end. So he can do it. I suspect that the reason why did not change all that much earlier in the season was because he was trying to instil a game plan into the side but that failed. Now one possible reason as to why that happened was because of the constant injury issues that the club has had and therefore it did not come off. Another reason maybe that it was predictable game plan. Or perhaps because the players did not buy it. Or a combination of the three plus more.

 

My reasons for losing faith in JVS are that at times the players did not show up - which indicate that he has lost them to some extent. he persisted with some players for far too long and he did not experiment enough during the season. He did so at the end but for me that was too late.

 

Do I want a team playing boring football but winning? I'll reluctantly take that. Much prefer a winning and exciting team but that will also mean that the player clean out continues.

 

The reason I think a coach from the UK would be good is because the majority of squad is Australian and thus communication issues should be easier to overcome and alongside this UK coaches even in the Second and Third Tiers these days also coach a lot of Foreign players  (You would be surprised how many their are when you look at Squad Lists for these clubs) and therefore have experience of coaching Foreigners in an English Speaking country.

 

I also think their is high variety of playing styles and formation used in the English Leagues these days due to the large influx of foreigners.

You also see a lot of UK managers who consistently get sacked and re-hired because of their experience in being able to manage and communicate with players... that's the type of coach I think we need.

Edited May 12, 2015 by cadete

[Tony999]

Nothing against UK people but hell no as a coach! Would never forgive Venables for failing to qualify for the WC with a squad, to me, was one of the best we have ever had.

Edited May 12, 2015 by Tony999

[Jovan]

This now leads to the philosophical soccer question style or results? Obviously both are preferred but in reality rarely achieved. So generally it tends to be either or.

I'm in the style over results. I prefer to rock up each week expecting fast attacking play individual skill and strategic on field battles. Over tight disciplined well drilled play with few goals either end and more likely than not 1:0 wins.

Having said all that we have been given nothing of this so far from either side of the ledger.

Interested in others stance.

[strider]

Get us Zico

[cadete]

This now leads to the philosophical soccer question style or results? Obviously both are preferred but in reality rarely achieved. So generally it tends to be either or.

I'm in the style over results. I prefer to rock up each week expecting fast attacking play individual skill and strategic on field battles. Over tight disciplined well drilled play with few goals either end and more likely than not 1:0 wins.

Having said all that we have been given nothing of this so far from either side of the ledger.

Interested in others stance.

When you have a punt on the horses do you prefer to see the nag that you are on make a great run from last to fourth or do to prefer to see it sit near the lead and take the win?

[KSK_47]

This now leads to the philosophical soccer question style or results? Obviously both are preferred but in reality rarely achieved. So generally it tends to be either or.

I'm in the style over results. I prefer to rock up each week expecting fast attacking play individual skill and strategic on field battles. Over tight disciplined well drilled play with few goals either end and more likely than not 1:0 wins.

Having said all that we have been given nothing of this so far from either side of the ledger.

Interested in others stance.

 

Unfortunately we dont have much choice IMO. It needs to be both if we are going to get people interested.

 

When it comes down to it I would take results over style (i dont think i can handle any more chirpy "we had loads of possession and controlled the game" posts around here) but in the long run we need to become exciting eventually too

[Jovan]

This now leads to the philosophical soccer question style or results? Obviously both are preferred but in reality rarely achieved. So generally it tends to be either or.

I'm in the style over results. I prefer to rock up each week expecting fast attacking play individual skill and strategic on field battles. Over tight disciplined well drilled play with few goals either end and more likely than not 1:0 wins.

Having said all that we have been given nothing of this so far from either side of the ledger.

Interested in others stance.

When you have a punt on the horses do you prefer to see the nag that you are on make a great run from last to fourth or do to prefer to see it sit near the lead and take the win?

I don't punt. Ever.

But if I'm watching a race horse,running or swimming and someone comes from Behind and narrowly loses i would have more empathy for than someone winning from leading all the way.

[NewConvert]

 

 

I have said it before but we should target an UK Manager with extensive experience at a number of clubs... someone who has worked with a lot different personalities and deploying a number of different playing styles.

 

JVS clearly has issues relating to his players some of his relationships clearly reaching breaking point, with the A-League's small lists has always been an hindrance. There is a long list of blokes now who played for JVS at Heart/City who clearly dont like him and seems Erik has joined their ranks from his recent comments in the media.

 

Another thing JVS has never shown is an ability to shape a game plan/structure around his particular squad or the league itself which yet another thing that a club needs to do in the A-League due to the league's particularities. 

 

I dont care if we get a bloke who has playing us boring football as long as its winning us game... I say it over and over again but I would take a dour Steve over a flamboyant Mark Waugh any day of the week because at the end of day all that matters is results.

 

Why do they have to be from the UK (Scotland, England, Wales, Northern Ireland)? After all UK clubs and players are not setting the football world on fire. Neither Chelsea nor Man City are coached by someone originating from the UK. Additionally, these kind of coaches tend to go shopping every transfer window because they don't have salary caps, something that may hinder their style when they come to Oz. Oh, yeah Magilton fits your description and he was not a raging success at MV.

 

I do agree that a manager must have enjoyed some success with different teams. By its very nature coaching a number of clubs over a number of seasons will have exposed them to different personalities. I will caution though that both Sir Alex Ferguson and Ange don't give a rats about the players personality (and neither does Pep Guardiola).

 

Speaking of the aforementioned coaches, they don't care whether they are liked. They are there to get together a team that will play a game of football. The bigger question is whether the coaches are respected. If players don't respect their coach it won't be a happy club - witness the Jets' Stubbins vs the five players. As far as Erik's comments are concerned Murfy did point out that the full interview did not deviate from what JvS had said earlier.

 

I will disagree that JVS doesn't shape the game plan to fit the side. He did that just last season when he took over from JA. He experimented a lot during the first five games with formations and players. What annoys me is that this season he did not do that until the very end. So he can do it. I suspect that the reason why did not change all that much earlier in the season was because he was trying to instil a game plan into the side but that failed. Now one possible reason as to why that happened was because of the constant injury issues that the club has had and therefore it did not come off. Another reason maybe that it was predictable game plan. Or perhaps because the players did not buy it. Or a combination of the three plus more.

 

My reasons for losing faith in JVS are that at times the players did not show up - which indicate that he has lost them to some extent. he persisted with some players for far too long and he did not experiment enough during the season. He did so at the end but for me that was too late.

 

Do I want a team playing boring football but winning? I'll reluctantly take that. Much prefer a winning and exciting team but that will also mean that the player clean out continues.

 

The reason I think a coach from the UK would be good is because the majority of squad is Australian and thus communication issues should be easier to overcome and alongside this UK coaches even in the Second and Third Tiers these days also coach a lot of Foreign players  (You would be surprised how many their are when you look at Squad Lists for these clubs) and therefore have experience of coaching Foreigners in an English Speaking country.

 

I also think their is high variety of playing styles and formation used in the English Leagues these days due to the large influx of foreigners.

You also see a lot of UK managers who consistently get sacked and re-hired because of their experience in being able to manage and communicate with players... that's the type of coach I think we need.

 

 

I don't think that Gombau has any issues communicating with his players. And I have worked with enough tools who had English as their only language and they could not communicate to save a company. Communications is more than ability to speak English and JVS' English is pretty good, so if there are communication problems I don't think that it has to do with the language. Besides he does have assistants that could help if required. Then there is the ability of players ability to communicate with one another on the pitch, which could preclude any visa players from non-english speaking countries.

 

I will presume that you meant to say that we need a manager that can communicate and coach the players rather than a manager that gets constantly sacked and re-hired. In which case I totally agree with you - this has to be an integral part of the job.

 

You also touched on a different cultural point. In Australian sports when the coach gets fired they tend to stay fired, very rarely re-hired. The only one I can think of is Rodney Eade - Swans, WB and now GC. Some others have been fired and re-hired as assistants: Ratten, Neeld, and Voss. The rest go to the district leagues.

[belaguttman]

Unfortunately we are competing in this market against a well established team that has style and results. If we gets results without style (like CCM) we will stay small and irrelevant. We won't provide enough entertainment with finding a way to achieve style and results

[cadete]

 

 

 

I have said it before but we should target an UK Manager with extensive experience at a number of clubs... someone who has worked with a lot different personalities and deploying a number of different playing styles.

 

JVS clearly has issues relating to his players some of his relationships clearly reaching breaking point, with the A-League's small lists has always been an hindrance. There is a long list of blokes now who played for JVS at Heart/City who clearly dont like him and seems Erik has joined their ranks from his recent comments in the media.

 

Another thing JVS has never shown is an ability to shape a game plan/structure around his particular squad or the league itself which yet another thing that a club needs to do in the A-League due to the league's particularities. 

 

I dont care if we get a bloke who has playing us boring football as long as its winning us game... I say it over and over again but I would take a dour Steve over a flamboyant Mark Waugh any day of the week because at the end of day all that matters is results.

 

Why do they have to be from the UK (Scotland, England, Wales, Northern Ireland)? After all UK clubs and players are not setting the football world on fire. Neither Chelsea nor Man City are coached by someone originating from the UK. Additionally, these kind of coaches tend to go shopping every transfer window because they don't have salary caps, something that may hinder their style when they come to Oz. Oh, yeah Magilton fits your description and he was not a raging success at MV.

 

I do agree that a manager must have enjoyed some success with different teams. By its very nature coaching a number of clubs over a number of seasons will have exposed them to different personalities. I will caution though that both Sir Alex Ferguson and Ange don't give a rats about the players personality (and neither does Pep Guardiola).

 

Speaking of the aforementioned coaches, they don't care whether they are liked. They are there to get together a team that will play a game of football. The bigger question is whether the coaches are respected. If players don't respect their coach it won't be a happy club - witness the Jets' Stubbins vs the five players. As far as Erik's comments are concerned Murfy did point out that the full interview did not deviate from what JvS had said earlier.

 

I will disagree that JVS doesn't shape the game plan to fit the side. He did that just last season when he took over from JA. He experimented a lot during the first five games with formations and players. What annoys me is that this season he did not do that until the very end. So he can do it. I suspect that the reason why did not change all that much earlier in the season was because he was trying to instil a game plan into the side but that failed. Now one possible reason as to why that happened was because of the constant injury issues that the club has had and therefore it did not come off. Another reason maybe that it was predictable game plan. Or perhaps because the players did not buy it. Or a combination of the three plus more.

 

My reasons for losing faith in JVS are that at times the players did not show up - which indicate that he has lost them to some extent. he persisted with some players for far too long and he did not experiment enough during the season. He did so at the end but for me that was too late.

 

Do I want a team playing boring football but winning? I'll reluctantly take that. Much prefer a winning and exciting team but that will also mean that the player clean out continues.

 

The reason I think a coach from the UK would be good is because the majority of squad is Australian and thus communication issues should be easier to overcome and alongside this UK coaches even in the Second and Third Tiers these days also coach a lot of Foreign players  (You would be surprised how many their are when you look at Squad Lists for these clubs) and therefore have experience of coaching Foreigners in an English Speaking country.

 

I also think their is high variety of playing styles and formation used in the English Leagues these days due to the large influx of foreigners.

You also see a lot of UK managers who consistently get sacked and re-hired because of their experience in being able to manage and communicate with players... that's the type of coach I think we need.

 

 

I don't think that Gombau has any issues communicating with his players. And I have worked with enough tools who had English as their only language and they could not communicate to save a company. Communications is more than ability to speak English and JVS' English is pretty good, so if there are communication problems I don't think that it has to do with the language. Besides he does have assistants that could help if required. Then there is the ability of players ability to communicate with one another on the pitch, which could preclude any visa players from non-english speaking countries.

 

I will presume that you meant to say that we need a manager that can communicate and coach the players rather than a manager that gets constantly sacked and re-hired. In which case I totally agree with you - this has to be an integral part of the job.

 

You also touched on a different cultural point. In Australian sports when the coach gets fired they tend to stay fired, very rarely re-hired. The only one I can think of is Rodney Eade - Swans, WB and now GC. Some others have been fired and re-hired as assistants: Ratten, Neeld, and Voss. The rest go to the district leagues.

 

PPL love to mention Gombau on here but the guy is yet to make a Grand Final, in fact if MV win the GF you could argue when did just as well as Adelaide this season if it was us knocked out by the eventual Premier.

 

Both coaches in this Season's GF are Australian as the last few and it undeniable that Australian's have been the most successful coaches in the A-League alongside a Brit/Scot in Ernie Merrick.

 

We should have thrown everything to get Arnold before last season but considering the best Australian coaches look taken for the immediate short term I think the next best similar type of coach as far as communication goes is most likely a Brit.

[GreenSeater]

This guy plz

[n i k o]

I still think Mike Mulvey may be worth a shot. Simply put, he's a winner.

[Heart_fan]

I still think Mike Mulvey may be worth a shot. Simply put, he's a winner.

 

I'm not sure his interpersonal and motivational skills are any better than JVS to be honest.

 

He got success with a very strong squad, but failed to get much out of them once a couple of key players left.

[moops]

I would love to get Milicic back here again at some point, just think of his apprentiship. Assistant to Popa and Ange in the national team! People were saying he was a good candidate before, but after his experiences he would also have learnt a lot more as well from then.

[NewConvert]

 

 

PPL love to mention Gombau on here but the guy is yet to make a Grand Final, in fact if MV win the GF you could argue when did just as well as Adelaide this season if it was us knocked out by the eventual Premier.

 

Both coaches in this Season's GF are Australian as the last few and it undeniable that Australian's have been the most successful coaches in the A-League alongside a Brit/Scot in Ernie Merrick.

 

We should have thrown everything to get Arnold before last season but considering the best Australian coaches look taken for the immediate short term I think the next best similar type of coach as far as communication goes is most likely a Brit.

 

 

I didn't mention Gombau's coaching record, merely his ability to communicate. It is true that the most successful coaches in the A-League have been Australian or at the very least have been in the Australian system for a very long time (Merrick, Mulvey) - and I have always held some scepticism about hiring a foreign coach because the constraints that the Australian league has may not be suitable for some coaches.

 

Personally, I think that Mulvey may be worth a shot or Milicic. Mulvey did well at BR but seems to have lost the players; maybe he is better for the experience. Ante is untried at this level but his work with WSW and the national team is excellent. I am not sure what to make of the current assistants at City.

 

So if CFG were ever to replace JVS the replacement coach will need to be better than what is currently available here in Oz.

 

Finally, looking at the back ground of some of the coaches in last years world cup I noticed that Louis Van Gaal, then coaching the Netherlands and now coaching Man U, was a secondary school teacher. Then the Costa Rican NT manager, Luis Pinto, was also a teacher. Perhaps a coach with some teaching experience may of some use.

[Jimmy]

I would love to get Milicic back here again at some point, just think of his apprentiship. Assistant to Popa and Ange in the national team! People were saying he was a good candidate before, but after his experiences he would also have learnt a lot more as well from then.

I'd be more than okay with Milicic.

[Ray]

Kosmina seems to be rotting away in the Foxsports commentary box too.

Or will we see Mr Mark Rudan make a huge leap into the A-League coaches den?

[johnno cpfc]

I would take Rudan with the proviso that it would initially be for 1 year with an option to extend as i have not seen him actually coach. That's not to say he will not make it in the A-league he talks about football very well so it seems to me he is quite knolledgable when talking tacticts etc. Kosmina is a totally different kettle of fish failed at Adelaide and Sydney .

Definitely would take Millicic very smart man knows football very well.

Edited May 13, 2015 by johnno cpfc

[n i k o]

Even Aloisi seems smart when he does 'expert' analysis fox sports, but when push comes to shove we know he's just a shitcunt.