Sack Vidmar

[Cityamatic]

Apologies if this has been discussed earlier in the forum, but am I the only one who is completely underwhelmed by the continual choice of ordinary managers by this club given the fabled world-wide clout of our parent organisation? Is it so hard to convince a decent established or emerging foreign manager to come out here that we're forced to recycle these local managers who seem to be recruited from the assistant ranks at other clubs after failed spells at the helm elsewhere?

I know the A-League is far from the pinnacle of world football, but you'd think a decent manager could be convinced to come out here, even to raise their profile within CFG ranks.... Despite all the dumb-ass rules this league has in place, surely off field staff are one area where the financial benefits of being part of CFG would be able to be applied??

[jw1739]

Soriano CEO of CFG said it a while ago. CFG has realised that Australia was not a good investment. I therefore doubt that they are going to throw any significant money at the club at any level - coaching or marquee players.

This season so far pretty well confirms this.

[Mr MO]

8 minutes ago, jw1739 said:

Soriano CEO of CFG said it a while ago. CFG has realised that Australia was not a good investment. I therefore doubt that they are going to throw any significant money at the club at any level - coaching or marquee players.

This season so far pretty well confirms this.

Whilst this group of players isn’t good enough. We lost some big chunk of decent ACL money due to individual errors this campaign.

Last night subs tells me Vidmar isn’t reading the game, experience on the park was required to manage the game, this was no night to play the kids.

Edited December 12, 2023 by Mr MO

[citypool]

10 minutes ago, jw1739 said:

Soriano CEO of CFG said it a while ago. CFG has realised that Australia was not a good investment. I therefore doubt that they are going to throw any significant money at the club at any level - coaching or marquee players.

This season so far pretty well confirms this.

I never knew that it's pretty disappointing then after we produced a few young players for them

[Le Hack]

1 hour ago, Mr MO said:

Whilst this group of players isn’t good enough. We lost some big chunk of decent ACL money due to individual errors this campaign.

Last night subs tells me Vidmar isn’t reading the game, experience on the park was required to manage the game, this was no night to play the kids.

Vidmar put on Maclaren, Galloway hardly kids, Lopane who's meant to be decent, and Politidis who is a kid and also almost won a penalty. I think a lot of you just want to spit the dummy because things aren't going our way this year. Toughen up for God's sake. Vidmar has inherited a squad which Petrillo put together which is too top heavy in over 30s so they can barely play the game out, and the mid 20s guys are pretty much plodders. And the kids not as good as previous years. 

[Mr MO]

55 minutes ago, Le Hack said:

Vidmar put on Maclaren, Galloway hardly kids, Lopane who's meant to be decent, and Politidis who is a kid and also almost won a penalty. I think a lot of you just want to spit the dummy because things aren't going our way this year. Toughen up for God's sake. Vidmar has inherited a squad which Petrillo put together which is too top heavy in over 30s so they can barely play the game out, and the mid 20s guys are pretty much plodders. And the kids not as good as previous years. 

You can call dummy spitting but the needed result just wasn’t delivered.

I hope you watched the game live.

JMAC was forced on because of Leckies hamstring injury.

Galloway came on in the 84th minute.

The balance shifted after the 66th minute when the kids came on.

Both Lopane (underwhelming) and Politidis are teenagers, never played on this level. Putting both of them at the same time was just bad management. There were other options with more experience to manage this game to the end.

Commenting that fans need toughen up when your club potentially has lost a lot of money is weird, this isn’t under 12s.

Edited December 13, 2023 by Mr MO

[jw1739]

No I didn't watch the game. All I can say is that two years in a row we've probably thrown away qualification for the knock-out stages by conceding a goal right at the end of the final Group match.

To my thinking this means we have not shown enough grit and determination  when it counts. These are the matches where the players have to play not only for a cash reward, themselves and their team-mates, but the jersey and their fans.

We have shown this grit and determination in the past, but not in last season's GF and not this season. IMO everyone at the club is accountable. Too comfortable. And whatever the actual reasons, of course fans are going to vent their spleen - that's what real fans do. It's natural to feel gutted and upset.

[Le Hack]

47 minutes ago, Mr MO said:

You can call dummy spitting but the needed result just wasn’t delivered.

I hope you watched the game live.

JMAC was forced on because of Leckies hamstring injury.

Galloway came on in the 84th minute.

The balance shifted after the 66th minute when the kids came on.

Both Lopane (underwhelming) and Politidis are teenagers, never played on this level. Putting both of them at the same time was just bad management. There were other options with more experience to manage this game to the end.

Commenting that fans need toughen up when your club potentially has lost a lot of money is weird, this isn’t under 12s.

I agree with Lopane he's a dud and should not have been signed,  I would argue that Antonis should have come on instead of him. Especially since Lopane caused the goal on the weekend. But maybe Vidmar wanted to give him some time to regain trust. Whatever. Galloway you could argue also should have been put on before Politidis however Galloway was also ill last week maybe he hadn't trained maybe he wasn't fit enough. Who knows. I just think asking for Vidmar's head this early is just over the top. We've had one coach go so I don't think it's the coach but it's the players or the make-up of the squad which is the problem 

[Mr MO]

3 hours ago, Le Hack said:

I agree with Lopane he's a dud and should not have been signed,  I would argue that Antonis should have come on instead of him. Especially since Lopane caused the goal on the weekend. But maybe Vidmar wanted to give him some time to regain trust. Whatever. Galloway you could argue also should have been put on before Politidis however Galloway was also ill last week maybe he hadn't trained maybe he wasn't fit enough. Who knows. I just think asking for Vidmar's head this early is just over the top. We've had one coach go so I don't think it's the coach but it's the players or the make-up of the squad which is the problem 

I didn’t ask for his head I’m being sarcastic as some still believe this squad is fine.

I said securing a 1-0 win in the ACL is managed differently and this played a big factor here as Antonis has been there before.

[citypool]

All the signings besides arslan are duds imo 

[moops]

1 hour ago, citypool said:

All the signings besides arslan are duds imo 

Aziz?

Souprayen hasn't been to bad tbf, maybe not brilliant, but not a dud.

[kingofhearts]

Fuck this guy. 

Get him out

[IssySG]

9 hours ago, kingofhearts said:

Fuck this guy. 

Get him out

Took eight games

[citypool]

15 hours ago, moops said:

Aziz?

Souprayen hasn't been to bad tbf, maybe not brilliant, but not a dud.

Yeah Aziz is returning I don't really count him as as a new signing. Soup has been ok I guess 

[jw1739]

1 hour ago, citypool said:

Yeah Aziz is returning I don't really count him as as a new signing. Soup has been ok I guess 

Sorry, but I don't rate either signing. "Signing" means both player and how long for in my terminology. Aziz failed in Scotland and is right at the end of his career. Souprayen likewise is just eking out a career.

One season for both, but not two. Two just blocks our Academy players, who then get an offer elsewhere and off they go.

The City person who should go is Petrillo. He has stuffed up this season and quite possibly next.

Edited December 13, 2023 by jw1739

[IssySG]

1 hour ago, jw1739 said:

Sorry, but I don't rate either signing. "Signing" means both player and how long for in my terminology. Aziz failed in Scotland and is right at the end of his career. Souprayen likewise is just eking out a career.

One season for both, but not two. Two just blocks our Academy players, who then get an offer elsewhere and off they go.

The City person who should go is Petrillo. He has stuffed up this season and quite possibly next.

1) He absolutely did not fail in Scotland. In all comps over 2022/2023 he played 3000+ minutes, and Dundee fans were gutted to see him leave - so not sure what measure you've marked his season as a fail? Did you actually watch him play?

2) Petrillo to go?! People love to shit on him when things are going poorly, but not give him any credit for building our double winning squad, and building the only squad in the history of the A League to win three consecutive premiers plates. We've been in the last four grand finals ffs. No one is at the top forever.

[NewConvert]

The history of the A-League shows that club go through cycles - even MVC & SFC have fallen. This is a design feature (salary cap, squad size). The one variable the clubs can control is the coaching and scouting. And ultimately even successful coaches will go through a down period and it is time for them to go.

Where City have let themselves down was in selecting coaches (no easy task) and getting the local scout network working properly. Another point would be that the fans have no idea why some players are seen as project players (Talbot) but others are not (Raphael/Cola).

Is Vidmar a permanent coach in waiting? An improvement on Rado but I still can't see his man management working. The ACL forces players to be rested if the club is to succeed in both competitions, and he did not do that. Secondly, I still have no idea what Lopane is offering vs Raphael or Mezzio for that matter.

[playmaker]

Apparently Vidmar is applying for another role at MCFC.

[Le Hack]

Aurelio is growing on me. Watched a few of his presses and impressed me with his honesty and knowledge and his willingness to give players praise and also a kick when they deserve it. Also seen a couple of his pre game addresses to the players and they do give you a sense of him geeing up the players. I reckon his half time address on Sunday would have seen some players cop an earful. Also like that he's not micromanaging the game but also says a bit during the game. I'm thinking he's the middle ground between Rado who was too laid back and PK who was too intense

[jw1739]

Still so sure?

[playmaker]

26 minutes ago, jw1739 said:

Still so sure?

On the fence.

He was out-gunned yesterday and had no response.

The team seemed rudderless and the manager couldn't tactically respond in my view.

[Mr MO]

19 minutes ago, playmaker said:

On the fence.

He was out-gunned yesterday and had no response.

The team seemed rudderless and the manager couldn't tactically respond in my view.

The tactical changes already started coming after 60 minutes,  something we haven’t seen for years.

We played with 9 men as both Lopane and JMAC were unable to involve themselves in the play.going forward. Maclaren has never been subbed this early.

What could he have done differently giving the quality of players isn’t top of the league and plenty of injuries.

Edited January 13 by Mr MO

[Zanty]

Vidmar seems like a great motivator but tactically is very average, has been found out in the ACL and select managers in the ALM.

Whoever becomes head coach next season needs be on a serious level above.

[NewConvert]

I don't think that the speed of City's backline is going to improve no matter who manages the team. There should be a lot of good byes at the end of teh season.

[Mr MO]

12 minutes ago, NewConvert said:

I don't think that the speed of City's backline is going to improve no matter who manages the team. There should be a lot of good byes at the end of teh season.

Agree. People easily seem to forget that with a few exceptions we have an average squad and the good fit players we have also have their limitation in tactical adjustments.

[Le Hack]

On 13/01/2024 at 7:59 PM, Mr MO said:

Agree. People easily seem to forget that with a few exceptions we have an average squad and the good fit players we have also have their limitation in tactical adjustments.

I don't think this was a loss through tactics. It was a loss because we had too many passengers and too many substandard games from players and just plain dumb attacking play. Second half we started to work harder and Vidmar made requisite changes in the team pretty early. Just the horse had bolted and then WSW didn't stop all over defensive efforts. Well done to them as that's the blueprint for all teams including ours.

[jw1739]

How do people assess him so far? Opinions on whether he'll get the gig permanently at the end of the season with another major squad rebuild possible?

[bellydrum]

5 hours ago, jw1739 said:

How do people assess him so far? Opinions on whether he'll get the gig permanently at the end of the season with another major squad rebuild possible?

So far he hasn't impressed enough to warrant a permanent deal at the end of the season

[NewConvert]

5 hours ago, jw1739 said:

How do people assess him so far? Opinions on whether he'll get the gig permanently at the end of the season with another major squad rebuild possible?

An improvement on Rado - on par with PK. On the plus side he is playing Sakhi in a better position, Good is improving, he makes substitutions and the squad is more fluid. He loses me with Talbot and Jmac. I don't think that Jmac should be the sole target and that Caputo should have a role because of his height and strength. Jmac is more a poacher and opportunistic.

Does he warrant an extension? Who else is available? The A-League needs a thinking coach that can motivate players by not shouting at them.

[Mr MO]

7 minutes ago, NewConvert said:

An improvement on Rado - on par with PK. On the plus side he is playing Sakhi in a better position, Good is improving, he makes substitutions and the squad is more fluid. He loses me with Talbot and Jmac. I don't think that Jmac should be the sole target and that Caputo should have a role because of his height and strength. Jmac is more a poacher and opportunistic.

Does he warrant an extension? Who else is available? The A-League needs a thinking coach that can motivate players by not shouting at them.

I can fully agree with this on the positive and the negatives.

[Zanty]

He has done well in the ALM but got found out in the ACL.

If this club is to go to the next level it needs someone who can do both.

[NewConvert]

7 hours ago, Zanty said:

He has done well in the ALM but got found out in the ACL.

If this club is to go to the next level it needs someone who can do both.

We don't have the cattle for ACL.

[D.B. Cooper]

I’ve liked what I’ve seen from him so far. 

[IssySG]

6/10. Better than Rado but not an outright success just yet.

[jw1739]

7 hours ago, NewConvert said:

We don't have the cattle for ACL.

Very unfortunate for those of us who had waited so long for the ACL to make a complete mess of it two seasons in a row. I am probably completely off-target but I just get the feeling that we did not take it seriously enough, or weren't hungry enough. I think we need to take a look at our squads and perhaps take a broader view. Other clubs such as Adelaide and Central Coast seem to have much more diverse squads and have a string of youngsters coming though.

[Mr MO]

6 minutes ago, jw1739 said:

Very unfortunate for those of us who had waited so long for the ACL to make a complete mess of it two seasons in a row. I am probably completely off-target but I just get the feeling that we did not take it seriously enough, or weren't hungry enough. I think we need to take a look at our squads and perhaps take a broader view. Other clubs such as Adelaide and Central Coast seem to have much more diverse squads and have a string of youngsters coming though.

It's all got to do with our budgets right, for example we've internally capped the marquee spots. If your marquee and designated player group are not up to real ACL level than you cannot expect any real progress in that tournament - that is shown in recent years.

The only players who can reach the required level are a fit Leckie and Arslan but were not fit at the time of the recent ACL campaign. 

[Zanty]

We have had the squad to get out of the ACL two campaigns on the run and failed, the first one slightly more excusable because of the conditions but this season was terrible, Rado picked up more points in the ACL with this team than Vidmar did, Vidmar got tactically outclassed in the ACL imo.

[kingofhearts]

Their should be no decision about the coach until the end of the season.

We don't want another rado 2.0 situation 

[jw1739]

1 hour ago, Zanty said:

We have had the squad to get out of the ACL two campaigns on the run and failed, the first one slightly more excusable because of the conditions but this season was terrible, Rado picked up more points in the ACL with this team than Vidmar did, Vidmar got tactically outclassed in the ACL imo.

Rado had had the squad together since July. Our performances in the Australia Cup and the ACL were not good, and basically Rado went to Petrillo and said he could not get any more out of the squad. Vidmar came in at what sounds like one telephone call to him from Petrillo. All the timings can be checked if a timeline is required.

If Rado had any input to the make-up of the squad we don't know, but Vidmar came in absolutely cold. He commented several times that he had had very few actual training sessions with the squad as the fixtures came thick and fast.

He is on record that the boys had a session without him about the season and the way we were playing. We then seemed to make some progress until, by all accounts, we were as dismal as ever against WSW. One swallow doesn't make a summer, but my opinion at this stage is that we need to complete the whole season with him in charge and then review what it is that we are trying to do, because another significant rebuild is in the offing.

TBH I don't think that he has much to work with. IMO there are a couple of signings that don't make sense. Leckie and Nabbout have been out for months, as has Sulemani.  JMac is out of sorts. Where is Durakovic? Natel and Jakolis are hot and cold. The defence is slow and porous. Give him the season.

[NewConvert]

I suspect that the way the contracts were timed was precisely to ensure that there was a rebuild at season's end. Backline and front line have ageing list mostly in their 30s. From the last wave, City sold Tilio, Bos, Metcalfe and O'Neill - not sure on Glover. So now Petrillo is going to be looking at the next generation of youth players with a solid core of experienced players to mentor them. I don't think the ACL is in the big picture for CFG but a bonus if we progress.