City Football Group (CFG) [Owner of Melbourne City]

[illeatyourheart]

54 minutes ago, M13 said:

Brilliant.. and up north they wear maroon?

Yep, all the QLD teams usually wear it as their colour. I think Roar even used to have it as part of their kit

Edited December 5, 2015 by illeatyourheart

[Shahanga]

1 hour ago, M13 said:

 

[Shahanga]

1 hour ago, M13 said:

Brilliant.. and up north they wear maroon?

Well yeah it's our state colour, same as sky blue for NSW. Roar played in a part Maroon strip when they called themselves "Queensland Roar", before North Queensland and Gold Coast (briefly) came in to the league.

The state colours are a big deal in Oz, that's why the tards adopted Victoria's royal blue and Adelaide pissants the South Australian red.

so you like maroon? You'll be a big hit in Brisbane but don't move to Sydney!

[belaguttman]

3 hours ago, Dylan said:

M13 for your information, queensland is like the deep south of australia (but its north, australia all upside down etc etc)

Queensland state colour is maroon! So we can choose between a Qld colour, a NSW colour or our biggest rivals colour, that really helps our identity

Edited December 5, 2015 by belaguttman

[tigerou812]

Well we (Victoria) used to be called the garden state. I'd like us to be a nice green colour for something different. CFG are going to do what they what anyway. And who knows if the FFA keep going the way they are we may not have a league anyway. Or if we aren't getting the crowds etc, CFG may just pull out and cut their loses. But hey you have to live in hope. I just want something that's ours not some hand me down.

[jeffplz]

30 minutes ago, tigerou812 said:

Well we (Victoria) used to be called the garden state. I'd like us to be a nice green colour for something different. CFG are going to do what they what anyway. And who knows if the FFA keep going the way they are we may not have a league anyway. Or if we aren't getting the crowds etc, CFG may just pull out and cut their loses. But hey you have to live in hope. I just want something that's ours not some hand me down.

do you really think we can go through another rebranding? colours are huge.

[GreenSeater]

So since Manchester lost to Stoke this week and we beat Central Coast who are essentially the Australian version of Stoke, does that mean we go up in the CFG pecking order?

[M13]

54 minutes ago, GreenSeater said:

So since Manchester lost to Stoke this week and we beat Central Coast who are essentially the Australian version of Stoke, does that mean we go up in the CFG pecking order?

Above whom?..

[Jestr]

3 hours ago, M13 said:

Above whom?..

He meant off the bottom of the barrel 

[Tesla]

5 hours ago, GreenSeater said:

So since Manchester lost to Stoke this week and we beat Central Coast who are essentially the Australian version of Stoke, does that mean we go up in the CFG pecking order?

Off topic, but Stokelona is nothing like CCM. They're team is very good and I've been backing them at long odds all season as I believe they're going to come good at some point (perhaps it's started already). 

A number of their players wouldn't be out of place at Man City TBH. 

[Shahanga]

4 hours ago, Tesla said:

Off topic, but Stokelona is nothing like CCM. They're team is very good and I've been backing them at long odds all season as I believe they're going to come good at some point (perhaps it's started already). 

A number of their players wouldn't be out of place at Man City TBH. 

You certainly do your homework Tesla.

Anyone who thinks Stoke are like CCM hasn't been watching them play. Really they should have had about 5 goals in the game vs Man City & they have real quality in that squad.

[Tesla]

15 hours ago, Shahanga said:

You certainly do your homework Tesla.

Anyone who thinks Stoke are like CCM hasn't been watching them play. Really they should have had about 5 goals in the game vs Man City & they have real quality in that squad.

Seems they've come good when I don't have a chance to put a bet on while being overseas, kick off times appear to start really early in the day and continue to quite late in Europe (the 2 games I looked into going to so far have kicked off at 9pm and 845pm local time), so unless you take the time to try find out when games kick off it's pretty hard especially since busy all day (as opposed to being in Australia knowing they won't start till like 11pm at the earliest). 

But I've been watching them all season as I was impressed by their recruiting in the off season, they're basically a scrap heap of where the players who couldn't make it or couldn't settle in to a top European team have gone.

Shaqiri left Bayern because he wasn't first 11, was considered a great buy by Inter but didn't have enough time to settle before being sold for financial reasons 6 months later, and somehow ended up at Stoke when he should be in a top 15 European club. 

Afellay, haven't really followed his career in recent years but he basically had the choice of any club in the world at one point, went to Barca, didn't get game time and his career seems to have gone downhill and he has also somehow ended up at Stoke.

Arnautovic another I know as an Inter fan, he was a very highly rated young player but with attitude problems and I think that's why he has found himself at Stoke and not a club competting in Europe. 

Bojan, dunno why this bloke chose to play for Barcelona and Spain, any other club or if he chose to play for Serbia he would have been a regular for club and country at 18. Another who I dunno how the fuck they've ended up at Stoke. 

Then you have a few well known experienced  EPL players to top it all off.

The only surprise is that they haven't done better up to now. 

[hakz7]

8 hours ago, Tesla said:

Bojan, dunno why this bloke chose to play for Barcelona and Spain, any other club or if he chose to play for Serbia he would have been a regular for club and country at 18. Another who I dunno how the fuck they've ended up at Stoke. 

After all the comparisons to Messi when he started playing, he must've thought he was that good haha

[gundam]

Too much sky blue. I'm leaving the club.

[Kiro Kompiro]

the branding is an issue because CFG are determined to use their other clubs to promote Manchester City for the benefit of Manchester City. I think this approach is fatally flawed.

There's only so many Man City fans here, in New York and in Yokohama.   And even less Man City fans that will follow the local City.  Hell there are probably fans of New York, Melbourne and Yokohama who support rival EPL clubs who might consider bailing if the man City kits were worn.

Why can't CFG aim to create successful clubs around the world in their own right, free from overt Man City identification.  If New York, Yokohama and us win titles, Champions Leagues, and make money, develop youth who CFG can offer contracts to in Manchester or on-sell?  Why DOES Man City have to be *seen* as the ultimate beneficiary?  Surely they won't sell that many Man City kit and Man City Tour tickets to justify the investment the are making in the other City clubs?

Edited December 7, 2015 by Kiro Kompiro

[morphine]

46 minutes ago, Kiro Kompiro said:

the branding is an issue because CFG are determined to use their other clubs to promote Manchester City for the benefit of Manchester City. I think this approach is fatally flawed.

There's only so many Man City fans here, in New York and in Yokohama.   And even less Man City fans that will follow the local City.  Hell there are probably fans of New York, Melbourne and Yokohama who support rival EPL clubs who might consider bailing if the man City kits were worn.

Why can't CFG aim to create successful clubs around the world in their own right, free from overt Man City identification.  If New York, Yokohama and us win titles, Champions Leagues, and make money, develop youth who CFG can offer contracts to in Manchester or on-sell?  Why DOES Man City have to be *seen* as the ultimate beneficiary?  Surely they won't sell that many Man City kit and Man City Tour tickets to justify the investment the are making in the other City clubs?

I can assure you the direct word from the club is the opposite of your assumption. 

The club implores supporters to follow whichever EPL club they want to. 

[Kiro Kompiro]

So why then dress us up as Mini Me?

[Kinnibari]

Exactly, there is no benefit to us as a club to wear someone else's strip.

[Dylan]

Tin foil hats a plenty here.

[DFG_82]

18 minutes ago, Kiro Kompiro said:

So why then dress us up as Mini Me?

Consistency of Branding between the Clubs.

[possiblygeorge]

Yeah, would rather we don't wear maroon, thank you.

[jw1739]

2 hours ago, DFG_82 said:

Consistency of Branding between the Clubs.

I'm still struggling to understand what that means in terms of football clubs.

[possiblygeorge]

We could win the league, get labeled a 'plastic' Club and i wouldn't even be mad, because technically, we are.

[belaguttman]

12 minutes ago, jw1739 said:

I'm still struggling to understand what that means in terms of football clubs.

It means that we are a brand, intellectual property, a marketing tool rather than the 'old days' when we'd aspire to having our own identity

[jw1739]

4 minutes ago, belaguttman said:

It means that we are a brand, intellectual property, a marketing tool rather than the 'old days' when we'd aspire to having our own identity

I realise that Bela, but what is it we're trying to sell that has benefit in being identified with the CFG "brand"?

[belaguttman]

47 minutes ago, jw1739 said:

I realise that Bela, but what is it we're trying to sell that has benefit in being identified with the CFG "brand"?

The brand itself is apparently the product I think.

[M13]

11 hours ago, Kiro Kompiro said:

the branding is an issue because CFG are determined to use their other clubs to promote Manchester City for the benefit of Manchester City. I think this approach is fatally flawed.

There's only so many Man City fans here, in New York and in Yokohama.   And even less Man City fans that will follow the local City.  Hell there are probably fans of New York, Melbourne and Yokohama who support rival EPL clubs who might consider bailing if the man City kits were worn.

Why can't CFG aim to create successful clubs around the world in their own right, free from overt Man City identification.  If New York, Yokohama and us win titles, Champions Leagues, and make money, develop youth who CFG can offer contracts to in Manchester or on-sell?  Why DOES Man City have to be *seen* as the ultimate beneficiary?  Surely they won't sell that many Man City kit and Man City Tour tickets to justify the investment the are making in the other City clubs?

You make the same mistake as many Manchester City fans.. that believe that CFG exists to enhance Manchester City.
You must think bigger, Fanta doesn´t exist to promote Coca-Cola..Just like Sprite or Minute Maid it exists to be a part of total brewery range sort of

[NewConvert]

8 hours ago, jw1739 said:

I'm still struggling to understand what that means in terms of football clubs.

 

7 hours ago, belaguttman said:

It means that we are a brand, intellectual property, a marketing tool rather than the 'old days' when we'd aspire to having our own identity

 

7 hours ago, jw1739 said:

I realise that Bela, but what is it we're trying to sell that has benefit in being identified with the CFG "brand"?

I suspect that this is the beginning of another phase of globalisation of sports. The people who own Man U also own the Buccaneers as two separate clubs with their own identity. CFG are doing a similar thing but only in one sport and across the globe. I think that Bela has it right - in the future it will provide marketing billboard across the globe 24/7. So if you were Etihad Airlines, you would be advertised by all clubs using the one platform and the same marketing strategy for that market segment. This way, international companies will not have to prepare targeted marketing for each country (they probably will but it would be a part of the mix) as CFG would have done a lot of the leg work. So why football? Well there are plenty of businessmen (and they tend to be men) who like to be identified with sports and other wealthy people, no matter how fleeting (I met some of them). Football's international appeal and The Sheik will form part of the branding. The additional benefit of football is that as a sport it is safe across various nations and cultures. Hence when working with Saudis, football is a great ice-breaker (another reason why I came across to football).

So how do the clubs benefit from this 21st century arrangement? First they get a solid financial backing which is a must for professional sports. Secondly they get stable ownership which is another must. Thirdly, they can afford to attract star power to a club, even if it is fading star power. Fourth, they can have decent facilities. Fifth they can do global searches for decent coaches (OK we are not there yet). And finally they can scout the globe for suitable players (2.5 out of 5 needs to improve).

The altogether separate question is how do the fans fit into this? What do they get out of this? Those that make the transition to the new ownership will be supporting a successful club. Those that don't will either leave the sport or just support their local club. In Heart's case although it had a committed membership that bled read and white, it was still a small membership. CFG are gambling that over time the loss of these supporters will be replaced by a new generation - a small gamble over a 5 year period iff the club becomes successful.

As for the other question regarding identity - that is a difficult one to answer. CFG are making allowance for this by using Melbourne's coat of arms. Where it backfired was that not many people knew that we had a coat of arms let alone what it was. Identity is a key ingredient in advertising/marketing but an elusive one to really get right.

[Dylan]

It's quite funny that people bemoan 'modern football' yet seem to be happy to use marketing  buzz word bullshit to suggest how we need and can create an 'identity'.  

Melbourne Heart was a hell of a lot more 'plastic' than Melbourne city so far have been.

A group of people come in, Choose a name that ment nothing, pick the opposite colours to the other team in Melbourne and in 5 years end up being nothing more than a counter point to that club.

[Shahanga]

1 hour ago, M13 said:

You make the same mistake as many Manchester City fans.. that believe that CFG exists to enhance Manchester City.
You must think bigger, Fanta doesn´t exist to promote Coca-Cola..Just like Sprite or Minute Maid it exists to be a part of total brewery range sort of

Sorry but this means the whole mini me approach is even more non-sensical. They don't sell Fanta in a can that looks exactly like Coke.

The only thing the mini me approach is going to do is help cross sell. It sure as he'll isn't going to bring in new fans. "Hey lets go see Melbourne City, they wear the same jerseys as Man City, they must be good too"

[M13]

13 minutes ago, Shahanga said:

Sorry but this means the whole mini me approach is even more non-sensical. They don't sell Fanta in a can that looks exactly like Coke.

The only thing the mini me approach is going to do is help cross sell. It sure as he'll isn't going to bring in new fans. "Hey lets go see Melbourne City, they wear the same jerseys as Man City, they must be good too"

No no...Think of it this way, say that a club got half a million fans. Now think about someone like CFG having say five teams with a 100k fans each. Who got most fans?..
As for CFG they are all about the football itself generating fans..They want ball holding attacking football more than winning ugly..
As I recall it the major NYCFC supporters group was formed by Man Utd and Arsenal fans mainly, believe it or not

The colours etc is as I see it something that mostly sponsors (and journos) love.. the "MAN CITY" connection etc etc

[M13]

It´s worth mentioning that apart from CFG there´s almost a dozen similar groups .. the most notable among them being RedBull

[Jovan]

Just because there are other groups still doesn't make it more appealing. 

 

[Jestr]

1 hour ago, Dylan said:

It's quite funny that people bemoan 'modern football' yet seem to be happy to use marketing  buzz word bullshit to suggest how we need and can create an 'identity'.  

Melbourne Heart was a hell of a lot more 'plastic' than Melbourne city so far have been.

A group of people come in, Choose a name that ment nothing, pick the opposite colours to the other team in Melbourne and in 5 years end up being nothing more than a counter point to that club.

I think you're simplifying the issue here Dylan. To distance the league from nsl days we had to start almost from scratch.

 Most team where created in similar way.

ffa messed up future development of the game in Melbourne by creating mv. Who do they represent? All Melbourne football fans? I don't think so. Where do you put next team in Melbourne? No clear geographical division means there was very little forward thinking making any future team creation and success an uphill battle.

heart needed better football people in administration to nurture the club and take it in the right direction.

Unfortunately we don't have enough of these people in Australia at the  moment. If you love sport and love to be heavily involved in running of it at a higher level until now you had to choose other codes, not soccer.

look how many clubs are run by ex afl and rugby administration. Even ffa is lead by them.

If you think heart was plastic and being own by overseas company and run for benefit of its business model is somehow better.........it's you're opinion.

This is how someone else could see your last paragraph of your post

 

 

"A group of people in North Africa get offered crazy $$$$$ for oil in the desert.

they don't know what to do with it as they have thousands of camels already. They pay western consultants to find a way to create more $$$$$ They create company which buys sporting clubs to buy best players to buy success to buy investors to make more $$$$$ They diversify and go global, buy club in Melbourne because of the potential market share, change colour to NSW blue and loose all but 1 derby.

you still think heart was more plastic than this?

Edited December 7, 2015 by Jestr

[M13]

14 minutes ago, Jovan said:

Just because there are other groups still doesn't make it more appealing. 

 

I meant that 20 years from now there might be a 100.. 50 years from now it might be the norm even if of course there will be ndependent clubs as well.
Heck.. In American sports it´s already a norm with sports groups even if it seldom stretches out of a certain area.
A bit like how MLSE own three big franchises in Toronto.

[NewConvert]

1 hour ago, Shahanga said:

Sorry but this means the whole mini me approach is even more non-sensical. They don't sell Fanta in a can that looks exactly like Coke.

The only thing the mini me approach is going to do is help cross sell. It sure as he'll isn't going to bring in new fans. "Hey lets go see Melbourne City, they wear the same jerseys as Man City, they must be good too"

Errrr. I will respectfully disagree with this. There are plenty of people who purchase products on the slimmest of associations. I have a friend who is just a complete sucker for shit like this.

[Deeming]

The fact that we are talking about this for the 100th time says it all. There is massive confusion and mixed messages over our identity and relationship with Man City. If even us keyboard warriors who sit around and analyse the club can't agree what hope does the great Melbourne community have?

Since the take-over we're told - you won't be a mini-Man City but you will get a similar name, and if they had had their way, (virtually) the same strip.
We got our own distinct Melbourne badge (which most people really like) but all the supporter gear and player training and warm-up gear looks like Man City gear.
 

[HeartOfCity]

Having been referred to in each article and news story as "CFG owned Melbourne City" and having direct links to getting loan players from NYC doesn't help either. Even if the clubs build a wall between each other we will always be a CFG owned team and media will always mention this. Can you imagine if we did win the grand final, it won't be just how good are Melbourne City, it will be This is the vision CFG had when they took over.

[Kinnibari]

57 minutes ago, Deeming said:

Since the take-over we're told - you won't be a mini-Man City but you will get a similar name, and if they had had their way, (virtually) the same strip.
We got our own distinct Melbourne badge (which most people really like) but all the supporter gear and player training and warm-up gear looks like Man City gear.
 

It's like dating someone whose Mum buys all his clothes. Not cool.

[Shahanga]

3 hours ago, M13 said:

No no...Think of it this way, say that a club got half a million fans. Now think about someone like CFG having say five teams with a 100k fans each. Who got most fans?..
As for CFG they are all about the football itself generating fans..They want ball holding attacking football more than winning ugly..
As I recall it the major NYCFC supporters group was formed by Man Utd and Arsenal fans mainly, believe it or not

The colours etc is as I see it something that mostly sponsors (and journos) love.. the "MAN CITY" connection etc etc

Ok now I'm catching up. I can see that sponsors would like this. Previously I only considered it from the perspective of fans.