John Aloisi

[Nate]

Very true, but I'm struggling to think of anyone else suitable unless we look abroad.

[Tommykins]

While this isn't strictly the thread for it, the Aloisi appointment has brought a few things to the fore in terms of the clubs coaching selection policy, as well as the autonomy they allow a coach to have over first team decisions. I'd suggest they need to stay away from Okon and Vidmar. Rudan and Milicic would be my primary choices, but again, not the thread for it.

[RoyalHeart]

Very true, but I'm struggling to think of anyone else suitable unless we look abroad.

No reason why we shouldn't look abroad. Think how good a Ian Holloway type would be.

 

IF we lose this weekend by a fair margin and dish up the same rubbish what is next for us as fans? Protest? Petition? Nothing? 

[Jestr]

Winning the first Derby last year has given everyone false sense of security and has put a positive outlook on things.

" she'll be right, give JA time and we will get better" this was said after first few games away last year.

Well, things are far from getting better and to make this pill taste even more bitter is the fact that we have much improved squad as well as full year + preseason to execute his plan.

Board obviously knows nothing about football or they wouldn't be sitting there like a deer in the headlight wondering ; what's next??????

Edited October 30, 2013 by Jestr

[Jimmy]

Fwiw, I know for a fact that at least three of our board members/owners are very knowledgeable in regards to football.

[malloy]

Winning the first Derby last year has given everyone false sense of security and has put a positive outlook on things.

" she'll be right, give JA time and we will get better" this was said after first few games away last year.

Well, things are far from getting better and to make this pill taste even more bitter is the fact that we have much improved squad as well as full year + preseason to execute his plan.

Board obviously knows nothing about football or they wouldn't be sitting there like a deer in the headlight wondering ; what's next??????

How would you know what the board are or aren't doing? I am certain the board know exactly what the situation is and they would have contingency plans. You need to remember that the board consist largely of successful businessmen they aren't going to make a rash decision. They always said JA would be given time. That being said they have brought in JVS and Nus who could quite easily step in for when, what all us supporters believe is inevitable, JA gets let go

[Jestr]

Fwiw, I know for a fact that at least three of our board members/owners are very knowledgeable in regards to football.

Now I'm just more disappointed to hear it.

Btw who are those 3?

Edited October 30, 2013 by Jestr

[Nate]

 

Very true, but I'm struggling to think of anyone else suitable unless we look abroad.

No reason why we shouldn't look abroad. Think how good a Ian Holloway type would be.

 

IF we lose this weekend by a fair margin and dish up the same rubbish what is next for us as fans? Protest? Petition? Nothing? 

 

Tbh, I wouldn't even care what happens on the field if we got Ian Holloway. 

 

His press conferences alone would be worth signing him, absolute champ.

[Semper Cor]

I agree that winning football looks good whatever the style and losing football looks ordinary. Results will trump style.

 

Right now, weve got the worst of both worlds - unadventurous, uninspiring football and no wins. After Sunday's performance, the club would be negligent if they didn't start looking around to see what's available in case JA can't turn things around.

 

 

We'll never know, but I would've liked to have seen how JVS would've gone in his third season because it at least looked like we were heading in the right direction. And if we weren't one of the top sides yet, we were earning some respect for the way we were going about it. Anyway, that ship has sailed. His ambitions are elsewhere and I'd like a coach who's heart is in the job. I think it's time to move on.

 

Agree that results will trump style, particularly in a results-driven sporting environment like Melbourne where winners are a lot more lauded than losers, this being especially important for football due to the limited media coverage. 

 

But like your second point, right now we don't have either, results or style, and the pertinent thing is that there haven't really been any signs of either improving.  I would feel a little more settled if there were signs, but nothing as yet.

 

Having said that, we need to keep in mind of the Wanderers slow start last season and where they ended up finishing.  The A-League is a marathon, not a sprint.  Hopefully the team in the meantime, can show more signs of wanting to go out and win games of football, as opposed to trying not to lose them.  One of the philosophies I believe the club was created on.

[japiedog]

 

Having said that, we need to keep in mind of the Wanderers slow start last season and where they ended up finishing.  The A-League is a marathon, not a sprint.  Hopefully the team in the meantime, can show more signs of wanting to go out and win games of football, as opposed to trying not to lose them.  One of the philosophies I believe the club was created on.

 

I wish that I could take solace in this; re the Wanderers

I just wish that we could be a little more "attractive" when we lose !

[Jestr]

Winning the first Derby last year has given everyone false sense of security and has put a positive outlook on things.

" she'll be right, give JA time and we will get better" this was said after first few games away last year.

Well, things are far from getting better and to make this pill taste even more bitter is the fact that we have much improved squad as well as full year + preseason to execute his plan.

Board obviously knows nothing about football or they wouldn't be sitting there like a deer in the headlight wondering ; what's next??????

How would you know what the board are or aren't doing? I am certain the board know exactly what the situation is and they would have contingency plans. You need to remember that the board consist largely of successful businessmen they aren't going to make a rash decision. They always said JA would be given time. That being said they have brought in JVS and Nus who could quite easily step in for when, what all us supporters believe is inevitable, JA gets let go

Directors are motivated by financial returns on their investment. It is a business to them nothing else.

Paying JA out to end his contact and then paying a large sum to a new coach is perhaps a hit they are not willing to take ATM.

However, I hope they are fully aware what potential medium to long term damage procrastination can cause to a new club fighting for market share.

[kingofhearts]

What is this great fascination with youth that everyone seems to have? All that youth has got as so far is a 6th place that we clinged onto, and even in that team our best player was over 30 years old. It it obviously important to develop youth but the way the list is now i would always rather more older heads than younger.

[Rellum]

I agree that winning football looks good whatever the style and losing football looks ordinary. Results will trump style.

 

Right now, weve got the worst of both worlds - unadventurous, uninspiring football and no wins. After Sunday's performance, the club would be negligent if they didn't start looking around to see what's available in case JA can't turn things around.

 

 

We'll never know, but I would've liked to have seen how JVS would've gone in his third season because it at least looked like we were heading in the right direction. And if we weren't one of the top sides yet, we were earning some respect for the way we were going about it. Anyway, that ship has sailed. His ambitions are elsewhere and I'd like a coach who's heart is in the job. I think it's time to move on.

I am one of those people who beileve those two ideas are not mutually exlusive, Forget the word attractive and focus on the fact that a certain style of football is more likely to result in you getting more shots on goal than the opposition and that will more often than not get better "results". You need more than a style to acually win ofcourse (Good players, staff, coach and the like) but I don't think you can win leagues buy rarley leaving your own half.

 

To me parking the bus and fire off a counter attack when/if the opposition makes a siginificant mistake is not going to result in loads of wins.

[belaguttman]

What is this great fascination with youth that everyone seems to have? All that youth has got as so far is a 6th place that we clinged onto, and even in that team our best player was over 30 years old. It it obviously important to develop youth but the way the list is now i would always rather more older heads than younger.

Young players are yet to peak in performance or ability and so potentially have more improvement in them under the right coach. Of course they don't have the same experience and can be less consistent. A bit more of a gamble, a potentially bigger payoff.

[Chez]

We'll never know, but I would've liked to have seen how JVS would've gone in his third season because it at least looked like we were heading in the right direction. And if we weren't one of the top sides yet, we were earning some respect for the way we were going about it. Anyway, that ship has sailed. His ambitions are elsewhere and I'd like a coach who's heart is in the job. I think it's time to move on.

 

some killer puns there mate

[MUTD/MLBHRT/ESSNDON]

Don't compare CCM style to ours... They might sit back, but they have a system that works when they attack. WTF do we do...? Can't wait for him to go... Victory inquired for JVS, hoping he wasn't interested because he knows JA hasn't got long to go... Can only hope. Also if we win on Sat nothing changes, any team can get a result againts anyone it doesn't mean shit.

[RoyalHeart]

Don't compare CCM style to ours... They might sit back, but they have a system that works when they attack. WTF do we do...? Can't wait for him to go... Victory inquired for JVS, hoping he wasn't interested because he knows JA hasn't got long to go... Can only hope. Also if we win on Sat nothing changes, any team can get a result againts anyone it doesn't mean shit.

     

[Nate]

 

Don't compare CCM style to ours... They might sit back, but they have a system that works when they attack. WTF do we do...? Can't wait for him to go... Victory inquired for JVS, hoping he wasn't interested because he knows JA hasn't got long to go... Can only hope. Also if we win on Sat nothing changes, any team can get a result againts anyone it doesn't mean shit.

     

 

"You just won the grand final, but it doesn't mean shit because anyone can beat anyone! Here's your meaningless trophy."

[Herman Cain]

He means that the occasional win doesn't make the style and level of our play acceptable, and it's a fair point.  Too many times last year Aloisi and others spoke with too much praise about our performance after wins, when really we'd been outplayed and had just hit them on the counter a couple of times. 

[MUTD/MLBHRT/ESSNDON]

Cheers bud.

[jw1739]

 

Very true, but I'm struggling to think of anyone else suitable unless we look abroad.

No reason why we shouldn't look abroad. Think how good a Ian Holloway type would be.

 

IF we lose this weekend by a fair margin and dish up the same rubbish what is next for us as fans? Protest? Petition? Nothing? 

 

The problem is that in reality MHFC is a private organisation run by a small number of syndicate members led by Peter Sidwell. All we are is season-ticket holders (most of us) and we really have no say in anything except if the conditions of the season-ticket are breached (such as, for example, moving a game away from AAMI Park - and we might lose that argument if there's some fine print that I haven't read).

 

We are not privy to the contractual arrangements the syndicate has with Aloisi, except that it's a three-year contract. We don't know whether there are performance targets, review mechanisms, what the termination details are if either party wants out, and so on and so forth. The club is not obliged to communicate with us in any way whatsoever, either as individuals or as groups.  And if it does it can be completely selective with the agenda, and doesn't have to take any notice of any communication if it doesn't want to.

 

I recall (was it last season?) YS had out a great banner before one game "We Demand More Heart". While it made people feel better I don't remember that there was much commentary about it - perhaps I missed that. Maybe the syndicate are acutely aware of how fans feel, maybe they don't care a stuff. Perhaps they have given Aloisi an ultimatum, perhaps they have a completely hands-off approach. Who knows?

 

I guess the answer is that in the end the fans will vote with their feet. Indeed, the absence of real growth in the number of season-ticket holders this season and the poor crowds that we attract for a city of 4m indicate that we already have. If the syndicate doesn't get the message by now it never will.

Edited October 31, 2013 by jw1739

[belaguttman]

Maybe the banner should say something like 'Heart Board, 24.000 empty seats cry out for your action'.

[HEARTinator]

@jw1739

"The problem is that in reality MHFC is a private organisation run by a small number of syndicate members led by Peter Sidwell. All we are is season-ticket holders (most of us) and we really have no say in anything except if the conditions of the season-ticket are breached (such as, for example, moving a game away from AAMI Park - and we might lose that argument if there's some fine print that I haven't read)."

True but I also got the impression at the fan forum earlier this year that Sidwell was getting the message from the floor that fans wanted to see a far more competitive team that aimed to win trophies. So I think JA has been given a chance to create his own team and see what he an do. I wouldn't be surprised if the board gave JA till mid season to show that he had turned the ship around. Surely they understand that their investment in the club is dependent on the team actually performing well and being attractive to watch - especially Oz wide on FTA.

[Nate]

I think the strangest thing for me is the disparity between our gameplan in pre-season and our execution during the season proper so far.

 

I could have sworn the primary focus during pre-season was short passing, controlling possession and waiting patiently for opportunities to present themselves. 

 

We saw a bit of that in the CCM game in small periods, but otherwise it's been the same old hoofball.

[belaguttman]

I think the strangest thing for me is the disparity between our gameplan in pre-season and our execution during the season proper so far.

 

I could have sworn the primary focus during pre-season was short passing, controlling possession and waiting patiently for opportunities to present themselves. 

 

We saw a bit of that in the CCM game in small periods, but otherwise it's been the same old hoofball.

I think that was plan E (for Engelaar). Without him, JA doesn't believe that we can control midfield and so uses plan B (for bypass midfield)

[baddersss]

Very true, but I'm struggling to think of anyone else suitable unless we look abroad.

No reason why we shouldn't look abroad. Think how good a Ian Holloway type would be.

IF we lose this weekend by a fair margin and dish up the same rubbish what is next for us as fans? Protest? Petition? Nothing?

Holloway?!

Walked away from Palace because he'd lost the dressing room 10 games into a season, relegated my club Leicester, and is an absolute wanker.

[Torn Asunder]

Holloway has had good success at CC level where coaching cleverly and getting the best out of your players wins games. In the EPL this alone is not enough as you need world class players. With a mediocre squad and coming up against the best players in the world, it wouldn't matter how good a coach you are, eventually you end up at the relegation end of the table.

[theresonlyonebzamora]

 

 

Very true, but I'm struggling to think of anyone else suitable unless we look abroad.

No reason why we shouldn't look abroad. Think how good a Ian Holloway type would be.

IF we lose this weekend by a fair margin and dish up the same rubbish what is next for us as fans? Protest? Petition? Nothing?

Holloway?!

Walked away from Palace because he'd lost the dressing room 10 games into a season, relegated my club Leicester, and is an absolute wanker.

 

 

serves you right for being a foxes supporter

[MUTD/MLBHRT/ESSNDON]

Did any1 watch the game last night...? Adelaide's system playing from the back is getting better and better every week, they won't be dropping points every game for much longer. They've had this new coach for 3 games now and you just no what his trying to do and it looks so promising. It's fkn frustrating looking at JA's game plan after 35+ games.

[Luke]

Is he gone yet ? 

[cadete]

Did any1 watch the game last night...? Adelaide's system playing from the back is getting better and better every week, they won't be dropping points every game for much longer. They've had this new coach for 3 games now and you just no what his trying to do and it looks so promising. It's fkn frustrating looking at JA's game plan after 35+ games.

Can u become a Adelaide supporter then?

[Jestr]

Did any1 watch the game last night...? Adelaide's system playing from the back is getting better and better every week, they won't be dropping points every game for much longer. They've had this new coach for 3 games now and you just no what his trying to do and it looks so promising. It's fkn frustrating looking at JA's game plan after 35+ games.

Can u become a Adelaide supporter then? He gets lots of shit on here, but what he said is true

[thedukeofhearts]

We all see it. Most fans agree, I just wonder what the board thinks though. I know we will never really know because they aren't going to come out and say it, but I wonder if they really are delusional and think we are playing great or they are talking and looking at other options or regretting putting JA in. We will never really know until something happens I guess.

[alexandro]

He said something yesterday about how he is inspired by how WSW were in a similar position 12 months ago. That's silly. It was WSW's first season. JA has already had a whole season! 

[Libero]

Di Matteo? 

[MUTD/MLBHRT/ESSNDON]

Worst case he stays till his contract is finished, end of next season... And just hope we make top 6 so we have at least some interest in the game.

[belaguttman]

Let's spend some big money and get Bielsa, now that would really turn the HAL upside down

[Murfy1]

Did any1 watch the game last night...? Adelaide's system playing from the back is getting better and better every week, they won't be dropping points every game for much longer. They've had this new coach for 3 games now and you just no what his trying to do and it looks so promising. It's fkn frustrating looking at JA's game plan after 35+ games.

 

Were you a Heart supporter during our first and second season under JVS? Judging by your words, I'd guess that you weren't, as JVS showed that aspiring to play pretty attacking football isn't enough. Saying you'll play pretty football A) doesn't mean that you actually will and B ) doesn't mean that you'll get results. 

 

Adelaide United are starting to have some eye-catching performances under Josep Gombau, I agree, despite the fact that they've lost the last 2 games and have only picked up 1 point over the last 3.

 

But for every Josep Gombau there is a Rini Coolen. That is, there's another coach that promised attacking football, and that coach didn't deliver that style of football or results. Indeed, a club often has to go through a number of coaches before they happen upon one that can actually play good football, and maybe get good results as well. The point is that there's no certainty that if a club brings in a new coach that he'll either play attacking football or get results, despite the fact that most coaches now promise to do both.

 

I'd like to see us play good attacking football. That aspiration was a main reason why I became a Heart supporter in the club's first season. But Australia has precious few good coaches, and I don't think there's a good replacement for JA ATM. At best, a new coach would most likely go how Kosmina went at Adelaide. He'd give the club a short term boost after he took over, as players lift their game to impress the new coach. But after the sugar hit, we'd be no better off than we were prior to the coach change.  

 

If Aloisi doesn't show any real signs of improvement or get results by, lets say our 7th game, then he probably should go, if only because it's the done thing to sack the coach (it would be a gamble, as coach changes always are, but if things are that bad it can be legitimate to take a gamble). I still have some hope that Aloisi can lift his game and become a good A-League coach. He's given us a few positive surprises, and I'm hoping he can give us a few more. This isn't the EPL or Serie-A, so hopefully now that he's chosen his own squad, JA can rise to being a solid A-League coach. And if he can't do the job 7 games into this season, I'll support the idea of sacking him.

 

Gombau at Adelaide doesn't really prove anything one way or the other, though.

Edited November 2, 2013 by Murfy1

[Jestr]

I don't particularly enjoy seeing people terminated/sacked and I liked JA as a player.

I just wished he has attempted his coaching methods at a lower level comp.

HAL team is not a place to begin your apprenticeship

[HEARTinator]

Did any1 watch the game last night...? Adelaide's system playing from the back is getting better and better every week, they won't be dropping points every game for much longer. They've had this new coach for 3 games now and you just no what his trying to do and it looks so promising. It's fkn frustrating looking at JA's game plan after 35+ games.

Agree with you that both sides last night put on a good show and AU developing nicely under Gombau. WSW showed that you can counter attack very quickly and get results BUT they also put constant pressure on AU when they didn't have the ball, pressuring high up the pitch. AU did really well to keep possession and did not resort to many hoofballs to ease the pressure.

Yes frustrating under JA but I'd like to see where we are at around Christmas. I'm pretty sure that the board is taking plenty of interest in JA's progress but if he was to go I can't see a quick, easy option.

Edited November 2, 2013 by HEARTinator