Potential A-league signings

[Tommykins]

Scores a lot of goals in the local leagues from midfield right? Not a bad shout

[mus-28]

Apparently he's the main reason Sutherland are atop the NSWPL. He's just turned 25, seems a waste that he's never really got his chance at A-League level. Another reason the league needs to be expanded to 12 teams ASAP.

[Nate]

Apparently he's the main reason Sutherland are atop the NSWPL. He's just turned 25, seems a waste that he's never really got his chance at A-League level. Another reason the league needs to be expanded to 12 teams ASAP.

I agree with this, people always bang on about how more teams will dilute the "talent pool" and therefore diminish the quality of the league but all I reckon it does is allow a greater chance to potentially unearth some upcoming stars.

[morphine]

That's just horrible logic. We can't even fill our roster with decent Australian talent, how the fuck would two more teams do it???

[Nate]

That's just horrible logic. We can't even fill our roster with decent Australian talent, how the fuck would two more teams do it???

Well we did blood/provide opportunities to unproven young Australian talents such as Marrone, Behich, Good, Hamill, Walker, Redmayne and Goodwin but alright.

[Tommykins]

And to bring it up for the thousandth time, WSW was 90% rejects that we wouldn't have been keen on. I don't think it'd dilute the talent pool too much.

[morphine]

Well we did blood/provide opportunities to unproven young Australian talents such as Marrone, Behich, Good, Hamill, Walker, Redmayne and Goodwin but alright.

Ugh. You're not getting it. Right now, take 35 players from lower leagues and imagine two new teams. You're saying that would make the competition stronger??? No way in hell.

[Nate]

 

Well we did blood/provide opportunities to unproven young Australian talents such as Marrone, Behich, Good, Hamill, Walker, Redmayne and Goodwin but alright.

Ugh. You're not getting it. Right now, take 35 players from lower leagues and imagine two new teams. You're saying that would make the competition stronger??? No way in hell.

 

Who says they all have to be from lower leagues, why can't some be from the AIS?

If they were 35 Hoffmans then yes, the competition would be worse off for it but I'm talking about good, young talent which I believe there is a lot of.

[morphine]

That's fair enough Nate, you can believe that and you may be right. But if you are, can you explain to me why there are currently still duds running around? We didn't keep Hoffman on because we like his personality (although sometimes I wonder). We believe that there aren't any better alternatives out there. I believe this to be the case too.

[Tommykins]

That's fair enough Nate, you can believe that and you may be right. But if you are, can you explain to me why there are currently still duds running around? We didn't keep Hoffman on because we like his personality (although sometimes I wonder). We believe that there aren't any better alternatives out there. I believe this to be the case too.

 

I don't know if you can judge the class of the A-League by the presence of Jason Hoffman, otherwise you'll judge the Premier League by Titus Bramble.

[morphine]

That's fair enough Nate, you can believe that and you may be right. But if you are, can you explain to me why there are currently still duds running around? We didn't keep Hoffman on because we like his personality (although sometimes I wonder). We believe that there aren't any better alternatives out there. I believe this to be the case too.

 

I don't know if you can judge the class of the A-League by the presence of Jason Hoffman, otherwise you'll judge the Premier League by Titus Bramble. If that's what you've concluded from my post, I conclude your IQ must be extremely low, or you're trying to shit stir.

It's called an example.

[Nate]

That's fair enough Nate, you can believe that and you may be right. But if you are, can you explain to me why there are currently still duds running around? We didn't keep Hoffman on because we like his personality (although sometimes I wonder). We believe that there aren't any better alternatives out there. I believe this to be the case too.

Poor scouting, poor development and poor selection choices.

Happens all over the world I guess.

[Tommykins]

 

 

That's fair enough Nate, you can believe that and you may be right. But if you are, can you explain to me why there are currently still duds running around? We didn't keep Hoffman on because we like his personality (although sometimes I wonder). We believe that there aren't any better alternatives out there. I believe this to be the case too.

 

I don't know if you can judge the class of the A-League by the presence of Jason Hoffman, otherwise you'll judge the Premier League by Titus Bramble. If that's what you've concluded from my post, I conclude your IQ must be extremely low, or you're trying to shit stir.

It's called an example.

 

Not at all mate, but you've just said Melbourne Heart don't believe there are any better alternatives out there. Melbourne Heart's player decisions don't define what the overall quality of football in Australia is, Craig Goodwin is a prime example of this.

 

Jason Triffio has been in the Victorian system for ages and then gets picked up by WSW and has a solid season. Given there is no elite pathway to Football in Australia currently, a lot of good players ply there trade in lower divisions and make the step up nicely when required.

[HEARTinator]

Well wel well, Millwall chasing Zadko!!!

 

http://www.footballaustralia.com.au/news-display/transfer-rumour--zadkovich-being-chased-by-millwall/72080

 

Hahahaha, shit club chase shit player. He was a friggin passenger for the Roos at the East Asian tourno.

[Fentonthescreamingcactus]

You are all wrong

[Nate]

You are all wrong

Give us the answers then oh wise master screaming cactus 

[Fentonthescreamingcactus]

My knowledge will not be wasted on a person of your intelligence

[heart_fan10]

That's just horrible logic. We can't even fill our roster with decent Australian talent, how the fuck would two more teams do it???

There are many state league players out there that are very capable of playing in the a-league, the problem is with the limited squad sizes and salary cap, teams aren't willing to take the risk of giving them a chance. If there were only 2 more teams for example, that's potentially 36 new AUSTRALIAN players that will be playing in the a-league.

It would force a-league teams to look more seriously at signing players from state leagues and youth teams, which will lead to many of them given a chance, and sometimes they only need one chance.

[sheepdog]

That's fair enough Nate, you can believe that and you may be right. But if you are, can you explain to me why there are currently still duds running around? We didn't keep Hoffman on because we like his personality (although sometimes I wonder). We believe that there aren't any better alternatives out there. I believe this to be the case too.

I don't know if you can judge the class of the A-League by the presence of Jason Hoffman, otherwise you'll judge the Premier League by Titus Bramble.If that's what you've concluded from my post, I conclude your IQ must be extremely low, or you're trying to shit stir.

It's called an example.

Not at all mate, but you've just said Melbourne Heart don't believe there are any better alternatives out there. Melbourne Heart's player decisions don't define what the overall quality of football in Australia is, Craig Goodwin is a prime example of this.

Jason Triffio has been in the Victorian system for ages and then gets picked up by WSW and has a solid season. Given there is no elite pathway to Football in Australia currently, a lot of good players ply there trade in lower divisions and make the step up nicely when required. The trifiro brothers are absolute donkeys. Solid season bench warming. Case in point regarding diluting the talent pool.

I'm with morphine on this one. Sure the standard has increased but lets not ruin that improvement by adding more teams just yet. Baby steps are whats needed.

I know we all want a 20 team promotion/relegation league but you gotta walk before you can run and this league is only just out of its crawling stage

[Fentonthescreamingcactus]

If these state players are so good why aren't the in a-league yet

[mus-28]

There is easily enough talent to spread around 2 more teams, particularly the amount of young Aussies that are struggling in Europe that would welcome the stability of regular football at A-League level. We've been able to give young players like Behich, Good, Hamill, Babalj, etc a start, whilst just last season Victory dragged Nabbout, Pain, Galloway & co from obscurity to A-League regulars. 

 

The following guys are Aussies either out of contract or playing State Leagues who could easily be A-League standard: Patrick Kisnorbo, Bryan Bran, Matthew Theodore, Richie Cardozo, Jamie Young, Panny Nikas, Matthew Nash, Steven Topalovic, Ljubo Milicevic, Petar Franjic, Klim Taseski, Milos Lujic, Andrew Barisic, Chris Tadrosse, Phil Makrys and the list goes on.

 

WSW showed what was possible with a good coach, good staff and some solid foreign recruiting. The problem is not the quality of players available, but more so the lack of quality coaches available.

[morphine]

That's just horrible logic. We can't even fill our roster with decent Australian talent, how the fuck would two more teams do it???

There are many state league players out there that are very capable of playing in the a-league, the problem is with the limited squad sizes and salary cap, teams aren't willing to take the risk of giving them a chance. If there were only 2 more teams for example, that's potentially 36 new AUSTRALIAN players that will be playing in the a-league.

It would force a-league teams to look more seriously at signing players from state leagues and youth teams, which will lead to many of them given a chance, and sometimes they only need one chance. I'm definitely no expert when it comes to state level football, but I reckon I know enough about it. I really, honestly, at my core and in my bones DO NOT feel like there are 35 or 30 or any more than a handful (if that) of A-League level talent at state level. I feel really strongly and without badgering anyone, I'd implore you to reconsider this view.

That's probably as nice as I can say it.

[Nate]

My knowledge will not be wasted on a person of your intelligence

Ruthless! Ahahaha

[heart_fan10]

 

 

That's just horrible logic. We can't even fill our roster with decent Australian talent, how the fuck would two more teams do it???

There are many state league players out there that are very capable of playing in the a-league, the problem is with the limited squad sizes and salary cap, teams aren't willing to take the risk of giving them a chance. If there were only 2 more teams for example, that's potentially 36 new AUSTRALIAN players that will be playing in the a-league.

It would force a-league teams to look more seriously at signing players from state leagues and youth teams, which will lead to many of them given a chance, and sometimes they only need one chance. I'm definitely no expert when it comes to state level football, but I reckon I know enough about it. I really, honestly, at my core and in my bones DO NOT feel like there are 35 or 30 or any more than a handful (if that) of A-League level talent at state level. I feel really strongly and without badgering anyone, I'd implore you to reconsider this view.

That's probably as nice as I can say it.

 

i didn't say the league would all of a sudden uncover 36 amazingly talented state league players. But there would definitely be a few that would flourish when given the opportunity. We're not only talking about state league players, but as i also mentioned, talented youth players who are perhaps seen as 2nd or 3rd option in their position in their current clubs could be picked up by an expansion team and be in the starting 11.

 

To put it simply, it's a very similar argument to why the a-league teams should be allowed more players on the bench, except on a bigger scale.

[Nate]

 

 

 

That's just horrible logic. We can't even fill our roster with decent Australian talent, how the fuck would two more teams do it???

There are many state league players out there that are very capable of playing in the a-league, the problem is with the limited squad sizes and salary cap, teams aren't willing to take the risk of giving them a chance. If there were only 2 more teams for example, that's potentially 36 new AUSTRALIAN players that will be playing in the a-league.

It would force a-league teams to look more seriously at signing players from state leagues and youth teams, which will lead to many of them given a chance, and sometimes they only need one chance. I'm definitely no expert when it comes to state level football, but I reckon I know enough about it. I really, honestly, at my core and in my bones DO NOT feel like there are 35 or 30 or any more than a handful (if that) of A-League level talent at state level. I feel really strongly and without badgering anyone, I'd implore you to reconsider this view.

That's probably as nice as I can say it.

 

i didn't say the league would all of a sudden uncover 36 amazingly talented state league players. But there would definitely be a few that would flourish when given the opportunity. We're not only talking about state league players, but as i also mentioned, talented youth players who are perhaps seen as 2nd or 3rd option in their position in their current clubs could be picked up by an expansion team and be in the starting 11.

 

To put it simply, it's a very similar argument to why the a-league teams should be allowed more players on the bench, except on a bigger scale.

 

That's a much better way of saying what I was trying to say

[Jimmy]

Anyone who argues against adding more teams to the league is daft.

(Obviously provided said teams are financial secure and aren't mono-ethnic)

[yelawolf]

The problem is not the quality of players available, but more so the lack of quality coaches available.

 

bang on the money

[morphine]

Anyone who argues against adding more teams to the league is daft.

(Obviously provided said teams are financial secure and aren't mono-ethnic)

The fucking Oracle has spoken.

[jw1739]

Don't think you have to suddenly unearth 36 brand new Australian A-League players who no-one has ever heard of before.

 

For example, a new club could have given Velaphi first-team football and we could have had Bray as our reserve GK. There's Garcia and Neill looking for clubs. Add players like Nikas, Konyit, Govas, Konstantinidis, Taseski...and you've got the basis of a fair squad. And there's plenty more players I haven't even heard of. And it's not as if we're short of talented NYL players - there's just not enough room in the senior squads to accommodate them once they turn 21.

 

I accept that there might be a slight dilution of talent, but I doubt it would be really measurable. And IMO the increase in actual football would be more than enough compensation for the fans.

Edited August 5, 2013 by jw1739

[morphine]

Don't think you have to suddenly unearth 36 brand new Australian A-League players who no-one has ever heard of before.

 

For example, a new club could have given Velaphi first-team football and we could have had Bray as our reserve GK. There's Garcia and Neill looking for clubs. Add players like Nikas, Konyit, Govas, Konstantinidis, Taseski...and you've got the basis of a fair squad. And there's plenty more players I haven't even heard of. And it's not as if we're short of talented NYL players - there's just not enough room in the senior squads to accommodate them once they turn 21.

 

I accept that there might be a slight dilution of talent, but I doubt it would be really measurable. And IMO the increase in actual football would be more than enough compensation for the fans.

NONE of those players ADD anything to the A-League. They are WORSE than what is currently there. Hence, two new teams would DILUTE the League. It doesn't get much simpler than that. You are actually agreeing with me with your logic.

[kingofhearts]

So....... have we signed anybody recently?

[gundam]

I'm assuming most of the state league players have been looked at and coaches don't believe they can make the grade, why not look at younger talent. Why not start by looking into school competitions and see if we can identify players who have potential and develop them into the next generation of stars. I believe the club had a schools cup just recently, not sure if anything came out of it.

[heart_fan10]

 

Don't think you have to suddenly unearth 36 brand new Australian A-League players who no-one has ever heard of before.

 

For example, a new club could have given Velaphi first-team football and we could have had Bray as our reserve GK. There's Garcia and Neill looking for clubs. Add players like Nikas, Konyit, Govas, Konstantinidis, Taseski...and you've got the basis of a fair squad. And there's plenty more players I haven't even heard of. And it's not as if we're short of talented NYL players - there's just not enough room in the senior squads to accommodate them once they turn 21.

 

I accept that there might be a slight dilution of talent, but I doubt it would be really measurable. And IMO the increase in actual football would be more than enough compensation for the fans.

NONE of those players ADD anything to the A-League. They are WORSE than what is currently there. Hence, two new teams would DILUTE the League. It doesn't get much simpler than that. You are actually agreeing with me with your logic.

 

how do you know those players will add nothing to the league when they haven't been given a proper chance in the a-league? by your logic behich should have never been given a chance by an expansion team such as us and he should be playing in the VPL at the moment

[HeartinHobart]

Don't think you have to suddenly unearth 36 brand new Australian A-League players who no-one has ever heard of before. For example, a new club could have given Velaphi first-team football and we could have had Bray as our reserve GK. There's Garcia and Neill looking for clubs. Add players like Nikas, Konyit, Govas, Konstantinidis, Taseski...and you've got the basis of a fair squad. And there's plenty more players I haven't even heard of. And it's not as if we're short of talented NYL players - there's just not enough room in the senior squads to accommodate them once they turn 21. I accept that there might be a slight dilution of talent, but I doubt it would be really measurable. And IMO the increase in actual football would be more than enough compensation for the fans.

NONE of those players ADD anything to the A-League. They are WORSE than what is currently there.

So Richard Garcia and the national captain are worse than anything in the a-league? Pfft!!!!

[Mentor]

Where do we put these 2 teams, the last expansion (non-sydney and melbourne) went so well, not to mention the fact that CCM and Newcastle and ourselves are constantly linked with financial troubles? 

[Jimmy]

Sure our low support base is concerning but for the most part we're a well run club and our "financial troubles" are mostly just presumed by the uninformed and don't actually exist. We're scungy not poor, which is probably a good thing.

[morphine]

So Richard Garcia and the national captain are worse than anything in the a-league? Pfft!!!!

Yes, because those two would be enough to field two new teams. They could be called the Gold Coast Garcia's and the Lucas Eel's...

[HeartinHobart]

Just remember 12 months ago Morphine, you would have thought Topor Stanley, Beachamp, Bridge, Covic and Haliti all had limited days left in the A-League because these players were at the bottom end of the Australian system, couldn't consistently cut it at this level. Then you bring in someone like Tony Popovic who's structures and coaching ability is first class. Now the names above are all members of a premiership winning team.

[Mentor]

Just remember 12 months ago Morphine, you would have thought Topor Stanley, Beachamp, Bridge, Covic and Haliti all had limited days left in the A-League because these players were at the bottom end of the Australian system, couldn't consistently cut it at this level. Then you bring in someone like Tony Popovic who's structures and coaching ability is first class. Now the names above are all members of a premiership winning team.

Covic was wanted by Postecoglu but they had signed Velaphi too long and coulnt afford another keeper of his billing was my take.

[mattyh001]

Where do we put these 2 teams, the last expansion (non-sydney and melbourne) went so well, not to mention the fact that CCM and Newcastle and ourselves are constantly linked with financial troubles?

 

Just remember 12 months ago Morphine, you would have thought Topor Stanley, Beachamp, Bridge, Covic and Haliti all had limited days left in the A-League because these players were at the bottom end of the Australian system, couldn't consistently cut it at this level. Then you bring in someone like Tony Popovic who's structures and coaching ability is first class. Now the names above are all members of a premiership winning team.

 

I get the feeling that people see the overnight success with WSW and start to believe its the norm.

 

what people need to remember is that two of the other three expansion clubs have fallen over.  pure and simple, there in black and white.  CCM and Newcastle currently have financial issues to deal with, while Brisbane and Adelaide have had trouble in the past.

 

that says to me that while the FFA did a great job with WSW and is probably one of the best ways forward, they then have to be careful and make sure its ducks are all in a row.  after all, whats the good of starting up another club if either CCM or Newcastle fall over a few months later (think of North Queensland who fell over and were out by the end of Heart's first season)?

 

frankly, i believe the talent is there but this notion of just starting up two teams up because the talent is there is a bad idea.  due dilligence is required. 

 

a particular problem i have with all this is that pathways into the A League still need to be developed.  i'm sure the state leagues all do a great job of offering some sort of opportunities to the young players coming through, but every time i go to a VPL game there seem to be lots and lots of older players dominating the main positions (particularly players >30).  surely the next thing to do is actually set up the state leagues to give greater opportunities for players coming through.

 

maybe i'm reading the discussion wrong.

 

the FFA has just started a new 4 year deal with Fox and SBS - there is no need to rush.  Mentor is quite right in that the FFA has to be very careful for the next expansion - remember that the CCM area in and around Gosford is about twice the size of Geelong population wise.  the FFA has to build the new clubs right.

Edited August 6, 2013 by mattyh001