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Blackout    210
On 7/2/2017 at 11:40 AM, NewConvert said:

I've worked with Saudis at an international level and last year I decided to be host to a Saudi student. I have also worked with people from various countries and backgrounds, and there is always a thread that I can connect to: alcohol, food, sport, women, music. Except the Saudis. These blokes were alien. Hence I thought if I hosted a student things may be different. Nah. The Saudi's would never have started civilization. They are infantile because an imam tells them how to wash their dick they just never grow up.

As for North Koreans - well I expect that the people (rather than their psycho government/bureaucracy) would be no different to the South Koreans. The Pakistanis have internal domestic problems but at least they know sports and quite a few drink. And the DR Congo is a civil war but at least they drink.

I've been meaning to ask for a while what you do for a living. Because your life sounds way more interesting than mine.

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NewConvert    720
6 hours ago, Blackout said:

I've been meaning to ask for a while what you do for a living. Because your life sounds way more interesting than mine.

Nah, my life is pretty mundane specially at my age. Engineer working in IT and telecommunications. Spent most of my life in R&D then switched over to a senior pre-sales role which is how I managed to visit so many places andwork in so many countries (about 12). These days I am in projects and mentoring.

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Deeming    585

One year since the Trump victory.

I was not a Trump fan (Carson, then Rubio for me) but I have to admit he has done a much better job than I expected.

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Shahanga    3,617
4 hours ago, Deeming said:

One year since the Trump victory.

I was not a Trump fan (Carson, then Rubio for me) but I have to admit he has done a much better job than I expected.

What's he done?

I don't follow US politics and it's hard to figure out from afar what the situation actually is with the "but he isn't Hilary Clinton" hysteria.

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2 hours ago, Shahanga said:

What's he done?

I don't follow US politics and it's hard to figure out from afar what the situation actually is with the "but he isn't Hilary Clinton" hysteria.

Nothing at all, a win for small government 

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Deeming    585
3 hours ago, Shahanga said:

What's he done?

I don't follow US politics and it's hard to figure out from afar what the situation actually is with the "but he isn't Hilary Clinton" hysteria.

He's been pretty true to his word on what he planned on.

He's stood up to North Korea.

And as @thisphantomfortress said he's been fairly small government 

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Tesla    8,101

He has actually achieved more than anyone before him regarding North Korea,

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Shahanga    3,617
6 hours ago, Tesla said:

He has actually achieved more than anyone before him regarding North Korea,

What's he achieved?

i get he's had a different approach but they seem the same threat they've always been (whilst trying to get worse) and it's still the most fucked place in the world for a normal person to live.

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1 hour ago, Shahanga said:

What's he achieved?

i get he's had a different approach but they seem the same threat they've always been (whilst trying to get worse) and it's still the most fucked place in the world for a normal person to live.

TBH the tensions only really started in the 90s after the famines before that they were a back water with occasional run ins at the DMZ. It escalated after Kim Jung Il decided to a. Systematically starve areas of "dissidents" and send food aid where he wanted not where it was needed b. Develop nuclear weapons to strong arm people into aid.

Clinton was pretty agreeable for lack of a better term. G. W. Bush named them in his "axis of evil" but fuck all else of substance. Barack seemed to soften his stance (rhetoric at least). All of this while the Chinese are propping them up because they (rightly) don't want to deal with the refugees should they collapse. 

Donald has basically ramped up the rhetoric and pressure on China to cut them off. More sanctions etc for misbehaving. He's basically acting like he's taking on the mob in NY in the 80s. The biggest issue is that Seoul is too close to the border which means invasion isn't possible without astronomical loss of civilian life. 

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Embee    2,368
10 hours ago, Tesla said:

He has actually achieved more than anyone before him regarding North Korea,

I think we all know who the real hero is here

Image result for dennis rodman

Edited by Embee
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Tangerine    32

Kim Jong Un and Donald Trump are almost the same person. They are both unconventional and unpredictable in their approach to international politics (that is their power), use brinkmanship, put their country first and tell everyone else that their country is the greatest. They also both try to manipulate any media and dismiss dissenting views as 'fake' or in NK's case just kill the dissenters. 

Trump is playing a high stakes game in East Asia. He has escalated where previous presidents tried to defuse. It might work. It may not. I'm still reserving judgement. 

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GreenSeater    2,740
2 hours ago, Tangerine said:

Kim Jong Un and Donald Trump are almost the same person. They are both unconventional and unpredictable in their approach to international politics (that is their power), use brinkmanship, put their country first and tell everyone else that their country is the greatest. They also both try to manipulate any media and dismiss dissenting views as 'fake' or in NK's case just kill the dissenters. 

Trump is playing a high stakes game in East Asia. He has escalated where previous presidents tried to defuse. It might work. It may not. I'm still reserving judgement. 

I'm no fan of Trump, but it's a real stretch to compare him to a mass-murdering totalitarian dictator

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Deeming    585
3 hours ago, Tangerine said:

Kim Jong Un and Donald Trump are almost the same person. They are both unconventional and unpredictable in their approach to international politics (that is their power), use brinkmanship, put their country first and tell everyone else that their country is the greatest. They also both try to manipulate any media and dismiss dissenting views as 'fake' or in NK's case just kill the dissenters. 

Trump is playing a high stakes game in East Asia. He has escalated where previous presidents tried to defuse. It might work. It may not. I'm still reserving judgement. 

I don't think anyone could say Kim Jong puts his country first.

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Tangerine    32
1 hour ago, GreenSeater said:

I'm no fan of Trump, but it's a real stretch to compare him to a mass-murdering totalitarian dictator

You raise indirectly an interesting question, so i googled it:

- According to news.com Kim Jong-un has executed 340 people in five years for ‘crimes’ including drinking and slouching (http://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/kim-jongun-has-executed-340-people-in-five-years-for-crimes-including-drinking-and-slouching/news-story/32d90b4a691b85b0ac66c802ee263c38)

- The US had killed around 2,200 civilians in the fight against ISIS under Donald Trump to July 2017 (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/donald-trump-syria-death-toll-campaign-military-operations-barack-obama-administration-a7844526.html).

Of course I don't think these two things are the same. My point in comparing the two leaders is that each will do what they think needs to be done whether it is conventional or not (or arguably right). If Donald Trump was leader of North Korea i have not doubt he would have pursued a nuclear weapons program and used brinkmanship rather than simply roll-over to the international community.

 

@Deeming I completely agree that Kim Jong Un doesn't put his 'people' first. In contrast they starve, die and are oppressed in many ways. However, i do think he believes he is putting his country first.

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Tesla    8,101
8 hours ago, Shahanga said:

What's he achieved?

i get he's had a different approach but they seem the same threat they've always been (whilst trying to get worse) and it's still the most fucked place in the world for a normal person to live.

Gotten China to agree with extremely tough sanctions which will basically cripple North Korea. 

Edited by Tesla
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NewConvert    720
6 hours ago, Tangerine said:

 

@Deeming I completely agree that Kim Jong Un doesn't put his 'people' first. In contrast they starve, die and are oppressed in many ways. However, i do think he believes he is putting his country first.

To quote the Sun King, Louis XIV: "L'etat, cest moi", or in English - The State is me.

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NewConvert    720
5 hours ago, Tesla said:

Gotten China to agree with extremely tough sanctions which will basically cripple North Korea. 

Not sure on this. China went to bat and gave some kind of guarantees on North Korea's behalf at the UN. Then North Korea went ahead and sent some more ballistic missiles embarrasing the Chinese government, that is when they applied the sanctions and since then they have reduced their rate of missile testing. There is no guarantee that the Chinese will keep the sanctions on a long term basis - could be just long enough for the tool to realise that he does not have that much power after all. I also recall reading (I think that it was in Foreign Affairs magazine) that back in the 50s when the war was on, Mao created the defensive lines for NK facing south. What that meant was that if ever the NK pissed Mao off the PLA would have an open highway all the way down to the DMZ. No one believes that has changed.

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