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hedaik

hedaik

Posted
Posted

 

 

 

 

Lugano :up:

 

I got given one of those shirts by the owners of a Turkish pub when I watched a game there

 

Top shirt?

 

 

Yeah it is a top shirt

 

The blue and yella one (although the one Ive got is more of a light blue)

 

I meant is it the same as the shirt in the top pic. That was 2006/7 centenary kit for 100 seasons of football, probably the best one we've had in recent times.

If it's a lighter shade of blue, it's probably from before 2002, when the blue we used was a royal blue, not navy.

Really lucky to have one, as their quite rare. Most Turkish teams didn't start mass producing merchandise until the 2000s.

Either way, would love to see it.

 

 

Its still at my folks house I think (I did just find Mrs Hedaiks Galatasaray hat which they gave her), I tried to find which one it is from google images but couldnt see it. Could even be a fake. I was there in 2006.

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HeartFc
HeartFc

Could be worse, the mongs have a 950+ page topic about Kewell and he plays for us.

mus-28
mus-28

Quite obvious who it is.......has even been previously mentioned on these forums. The internationally recognized bit gave it away. The whole A-League had better be prepared to be blown away by........

yelawolf
yelawolf

i don't think i've ever seen someone on the internet make a first xi with just 9 players   so congratulations on being the first

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InMyHeart

InMyHeart

Posted
Posted

Anyone read the herald sun piece today by Matt windley? We suddenly got roomFor 6 visa players or something ? Says we have 3 visa players plus 1 international marquee... Horrible journalism Pretty sure it was we had 6 spots left to fill? 3 visa players which includes an intl marquee Um nah mate pretty sure it says twice that we have 3 foreign players to add + and international marquee, so maybe read the paper before you're 'pretty sure'

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Dylan

Dylan

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Anyone read the herald sun piece today by Matt windley? We suddenly got roomFor 6 visa players or something ? Says we have 3 visa players plus 1 international marquee... Horrible journalism Pretty sure it was we had 6 spots left to fill? 3 visa players which includes an intl marquee Um nah mate pretty sure it says twice that we have 3 foreign players to add + and international marquee, so maybe read the paper before you're 'pretty sure'

 

 

Was Windley who also said we would be playing in red and black.

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Parrot

Parrot

Posted
Posted

I know we're obviously the smallest of the three sisters (Man City, NY City then Melb CIty), but I don't see why the following can't happen:

 

1. Villa comes on a 10 game guest stint - heads to NYC for pre-season

2. Duff enjoys some time off and joins Melbourne City after David Villa's 10th game.

3a. Lampard is signed by Melbourne City as INTL Marquee, helps us to the Championship (the Premiership will be ruled out by January) then moves on to NYC FC.

3b. Lampard is signed by New York City as INTL Marquee, but loaned out to the Heart for the season - helps us win the Championship :-D

 

We could have BOTH Villa and Lampard for 10 games, one as a guest player, the other on loan PLUS at the same time an international marquee PLUS an Australian marquee.

I also read that if Damien Duff is signed, it will be under the salary cap. (Presumably on a similar salary to what Engelaar was offered.)

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Dylan

Dylan

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Posted

 

I know we're obviously the smallest of the three sisters (Man City, NY City then Melb CIty), but I don't see why the following can't happen:

 

1. Villa comes on a 10 game guest stint - heads to NYC for pre-season

2. Duff enjoys some time off and joins Melbourne City after David Villa's 10th game.

3a. Lampard is signed by Melbourne City as INTL Marquee, helps us to the Championship (the Premiership will be ruled out by January) then moves on to NYC FC.

3b. Lampard is signed by New York City as INTL Marquee, but loaned out to the Heart for the season - helps us win the Championship :-D

 

We could have BOTH Villa and Lampard for 10 games, one as a guest player, the other on loan PLUS at the same time an international marquee PLUS an Australian marquee.

I also read that if Damien Duff is signed, it will be under the salary cap. (Presumably on a similar salary to what Engelaar was offered.)

 

 

 

We have Villa, I would hope they get a marquee in an AM role with Kennedy as AUS marquee, id rather have a team that will stay rather than a team of loan deals. I am hoping the rumor that some players will be cut comes true as it suggests they have found replacements and are prepared to take a hit in the cap to get these new guys in. 

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Jake

Jake

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Posted

are there any rules against Man City or NYCFC send players here, while subsidizing the wage?

Say NYCFC sign Lampard, then decide to send him on loan here but pay 90% of his wage, could he join as a cap signing?

Outstanding question which I'd like to know the answer to. But I suspect the answer is no.

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agoalie

agoalie

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Posted

Villa's official signing status hasnt been confirmed yet, he can either be a guest or a loan player, if he is a loan player we lose a visa spot but gain the opportunity to get another guest player, likewise if he signs as a guest player, doesnt affect a visa spot. International marquee is still open and not effected. Going on guest player, leaves 2 visa spots(taking into consideration that Duff is signed) + international marquee left to fill.

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Murfy1

Murfy1

Posted
Posted (edited)

are there any rules against Man City or NYCFC send players here, while subsidizing the wage?

 

Say NYCFC sign Lampard, then decide to send him on loan here but pay 90% of his wage, could he join as a cap signing?

 

It's really unknown what the answer to that question is. I'm pretty sure the rules on player loans aren't written anywhere (unlike the rules for normal, non-loan signings), so we can't consult any clearly written rules on player loans in the A-League.

 

 

A Fox Sports newsreader/journalist actually put the question to the FFA CEO David Gallop shortly after the takeover, saying that there would be a "potential situation" where Man City FC might want to "give [a Man City player] a loan stint to the Melbourne Heart, [and] because it's the same owners he may not come under the salary cap". And the question was would the FFA "be forced to potentially change several rules in light of this takeover?", and the CEO David Gallop just said "we'll certainly look to monitor that kind of thing", suggesting that the rules aren't air-tight and aren't free of loopholes.

(http://m.foxsports.com.au/football/a-league/david-gallop-would-be-happy-to-discuss-rebranding-melbourne-heart-with-new-owners-manchester-city/story-e6frf4gl-1226808927160)

 

But at the same time, there was an instance in January this year when Brisbane Roar were trying to see if they could keep their star striker Berisha, who wanted a big increase in wages, and they asked the FFA if they could keep Berisha if he signed a deal with a rich club in Europe (which was actually rumoured to be Inter Milan) and was loaned back to Brisbane next season. Unfortunately though for Brisbane, the FFA said:

 

 

This led to speculation that Inter could sign Berisha, loan him back to the Roar and pay the bulk of his salary.

 

However, that would still not give the Roar any relief, with a FFA spokesman saying Berisha's entire salary would be considered part of Brisbane's cap regardless of the potential split in payments between the two clubs.

(http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/football/brisbane-roars-plea-for-salary-cap-exemption-for-besart-berisha-falls-on-deaf-ears/story-fnk6pqhe-1226804190872)

 

 

So there is some reasons to believe there are loopholes with loan signings, and there are reasons to believe there aren't and that the full player wage counts towards the salary cap.

 

 

Also, it should be noted that precedent loan signings don't really illuminate things at all. There has been very little reporting on the contract details of previous loan signings, to my knowledge. But it's worth noting that Melbourne victory last season managed to somehow acquire 2 players on loan that should have had pretty expensive wages, even though victory had already used up its marquee spots (on Conteras and Archie Thompson. Which also means that Mark Milligan was under the salary cap, and he would have had big wages). The first player was James Troisi, who overlooked a multi-million dollar offer with Qatar to sign for Serie A side Juventus (with joint ownership with Atalanta) on a 4 year contract in August 2012. The second player was Tom Rogic, who was signed to Celtic on a 4 year contract in January 2013 for a transfer fee of $810,000 (AUD) from A-League club Central Coast Mariners. How these 2 players alone didn't gobble up half or even most of victory's salary cap last season I'll never know, because they presumably would have received pretty big wages from their parent clubs (by A-League standards, at least).

 

 

So what can be concluded is that seemingly literally no one understands A-League loan player rules. 

 

But I reckon Football Operations Manager John Didulica (who handles the club's signings) knows the rules, if anyone does. And I think it's very interesting that Munn confirmed on radio on Thursday that Villa isn't officially a guest player or a loan player ("a player within the squad", to use Munn's words). That makes me think that Didulica, Munn and the club believe that they might have room to maneuver, or they would have just announced that Villa is a guest player. What exactly the club might do, I don't know (I have a few guesses though). But they seem to think they can maybe sign Villa, Lampard and even some more marquees all at once, but it's not clear at the moment how they might do that. Perhaps we'll see soon enough though... 

Edited by Murfy1
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alexli

alexli

Posted
Posted

are there any rules against Man City or NYCFC send players here, while subsidizing the wage?

 

Say NYCFC sign Lampard, then decide to send him on loan here but pay 90% of his wage, could he join as a cap signing?

No, Man City has problem with fair play rules, you will not see them doing that.

Maybe one day we sign a marquee player and loan him back to Man City to help them avoid breaching the rules.

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Falastur

Falastur

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

are there any rules against Man City or NYCFC send players here, while subsidizing the wage?

 

Say NYCFC sign Lampard, then decide to send him on loan here but pay 90% of his wage, could he join as a cap signing?

No, Man City has problem with fair play rules, you will not see them doing that.

Maybe one day we sign a marquee player and loan him back to Man City to help them avoid breaching the rules.

 

 

Yeah, pretty much this. City couldn't do it as any player they employed would count towards their own salary rules, which have now been capped not by UEFA (who only care about the players who are registered for the CL) but by the Premier League's own salary rules. It's interesting to note that the PL's rules are actually stricter than UEFA's - they cap how much your budget can increase by year-on-year, and they affect your entire squad as opposed to just the players registered for a certain competition, which is how UEFA's rules work.

 

Similarly, if NYCFC were to loan a player they would have to be counted as part of their own squad rules - MLS teams are limited on numbers of players they can have on the books and also by the total salaries of those players. Of course, any player NYCFC loans in the next 6-8 months naturally will be totally free since the MLS rules don't apply to them until they actually start competition.

Edited by Falastur
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Parrot

Parrot

Posted
Posted

 

are there any rules against Man City or NYCFC send players here, while subsidizing the wage?

Say NYCFC sign Lampard, then decide to send him on loan here but pay 90% of his wage, could he join as a cap signing?

Outstanding question which I'd like to know the answer to. But I suspect the answer is no.

 

 

The answer is YES. Victory had an Australian marquee, an international marquee PLUS Rogic and Troisi both in the salary cap as they were on loan.

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jw1739

jw1739

Posted
Posted

 

are there any rules against Man City or NYCFC send players here, while subsidizing the wage?

 

Say NYCFC sign Lampard, then decide to send him on loan here but pay 90% of his wage, could he join as a cap signing?

 

It's really unknown what the answer to that question is. I'm pretty sure the rules on player loans aren't written anywhere (unlike the rules for normal, non-loan signings), so we can't consult any clearly written rules on player loans in the A-League.

 

 

A Fox Sports newsreader/journalist actually put the question to the FFA CEO David Gallop shortly after the takeover, saying that there would be a "potential situation" where Man City FC might want to "give [a Man City player] a loan stint to the Melbourne Heart, [and] because it's the same owners he may not come under the salary cap". And the question was would the FFA "be forced to potentially change several rules in light of this takeover?", and the CEO David Gallop just said "we'll certainly look to monitor that kind of thing", suggesting that the rules aren't air-tight and aren't free of loopholes.

(http://m.foxsports.com.au/football/a-league/david-gallop-would-be-happy-to-discuss-rebranding-melbourne-heart-with-new-owners-manchester-city/story-e6frf4gl-1226808927160)

 

But at the same time, there was an instance in January this year when Brisbane Roar were trying to see if they could keep their star striker Berisha, who wanted a big increase in wages, and they asked the FFA if they could keep Berisha if he signed a deal with a rich club in Europe (which was actually rumoured to be Inter Milan) and was loaned back to Brisbane next season. Unfortunately though for Brisbane, the FFA said:

 

 

This led to speculation that Inter could sign Berisha, loan him back to the Roar and pay the bulk of his salary.

 

However, that would still not give the Roar any relief, with a FFA spokesman saying Berisha's entire salary would be considered part of Brisbane's cap regardless of the potential split in payments between the two clubs.

(http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/football/brisbane-roars-plea-for-salary-cap-exemption-for-besart-berisha-falls-on-deaf-ears/story-fnk6pqhe-1226804190872)

 

 

So there is some reasons to believe there are loopholes with loan signings, and there are reasons to believe there aren't and that the full player wage counts towards the salary cap.

 

 

Also, it should be noted that precedent loan signings don't really illuminate things at all. There has been very little reporting on the contract details of previous loan signings, to my knowledge. But it's worth noting that Melbourne victory last season managed to somehow acquire 2 players on loan that should have had pretty expensive wages, even though victory had already used up its marquee spots (on Conteras and Archie Thompson. Which also means that Mark Milligan was under the salary cap, and he would have had big wages). The first player was James Troisi, who overlooked a multi-million dollar offer with Qatar to sign for Serie A side Juventus (with joint ownership with Atalanta) on a 4 year contract in August 2012. The second player was Tom Rogic, who was signed to Celtic on a 4 year contract in January 2013 for a transfer fee of $810,000 (AUD) from A-League club Central Coast Mariners. How these 2 players alone didn't gobble up half or even most of victory's salary cap last season I'll never know, because they presumably would have received pretty big wages from their parent clubs (by A-League standards, at least).

 

 

So what can be concluded is that seemingly literally no one understands A-League loan player rules. 

 

But I reckon Football Operations Manager John Didulica (who handles the club's signings) knows the rules, if anyone does. And I think it's very interesting that Munn confirmed on radio on Thursday that Villa isn't officially a guest player or a loan player ("a player within the squad", to use Munn's words). That makes me think that Didulica, Munn and the club believe that they might have room to maneuver, or they would have just announced that Villa is a guest player. What exactly the club might do, I don't know (I have a few guesses though). But they seem to think they can maybe sign Villa, Lampard and even some more marquees all at once, but it's not clear at the moment how they might do that. Perhaps we'll see soon enough though... 

 

It was reported last week that FFA would be clearing up the issue of loan players with the effect that the portion of wages applicable to the A-League would be included inside the cap. It is clear that in the past some players were on loan to A-League clubs with none of their wages being included - Behich was reportedly one of those, although there's no confirmation of that.

 

Whatever the case in the past, FFA is moving to tidy it all up. The advantage we have from having our sister clubs is ready access to potential loan and guest players who are already contracted within the CFG, but we won't have a dollar advantage.

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heartofthecity

heartofthecity

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Posted

Lampard could still be a chance perhaps? Looks like he's been offered a deal similar to Villa.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2650945/Frank-Lampard-tempted-New-Yorks-offer-play-Australia-America.html

So, is this some way of getting around the salary cap or are we just going to be getting all over NYCFC's hand me downs? Not sure I like that.

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Rellum

Rellum

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Posted

There will  be ways around this. A player could be signed on a lower wage contract and then when the loan to City ends then have an understanding with the player that an upgrade that will cover the loss in wage that they suffered in the early contract. Risky but there will be ways around this, espically as the contracts will span continents and different rules.

 

It really boils down to how much City want to adhere the the spirit of the rules whilst still making the most of them.

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Tonyboozeadams

Tonyboozeadams

Posted
Posted

 

Lampard could still be a chance perhaps? Looks like he's been offered a deal similar to Villa.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2650945/Frank-Lampard-tempted-New-Yorks-offer-play-Australia-America.html

So, is this some way of getting around the salary cap or are we just going to be getting all over NYCFC's hand me downs? Not sure I like that.

 

If the hand me downs are players like Lampard and Villa, I'm cool with that

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M13

M13

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Posted

The coming season is a one off occasion as NYCFC haven´t started playing yet.. But given the different schedules CFG or rather their sporting directors that have a conference call meet up each month could very well work out future loans and guest appearances.

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heartofthecity

heartofthecity

Posted
Posted

 

 

Lampard could still be a chance perhaps? Looks like he's been offered a deal similar to Villa.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2650945/Frank-Lampard-tempted-New-Yorks-offer-play-Australia-America.html

So, is this some way of getting around the salary cap or are we just going to be getting all over NYCFC's hand me downs? Not sure I like that.

 

If the hand me downs are players like Lampard and Villa, I'm cool with that

 

Can't argue with that. Still wish we'd get Lampard and loan him to New York.

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Jun

Jun

Posted
Posted

I wonder what's the difference between Villa being a guest for 10 games, as opposed to loaning to us for 10 games.

A loaned player counts towards Visa player allocations, and FFA are looking at fixing the rules regarding whether or not that player's wages will be required to fall within the cap.

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Murfy1

Murfy1

Posted
Posted (edited)

A rumour on 442 that City have talked to Scott McDonald:

 

 City had a chat to Scott McDonald last week about his availability, but he stil has ye to go with millwall according to someone I knowin the family. He is looking at china if he leaves millwall. 

http://au.fourfourtwo.com/forums/default.aspx?g=posts&t=93704&p=3

 

 

It was reported earlier this year in January and February that McDonald wanted away from Millwall (http://www.fourfourtwo.com/au/news/mcdonald-frozen-out-millwall , with a follow up article here).

 

McDonald ended up having a mediocre season with Millwall, and as he's apparently one of Millwall's biggest earners, the club might be open to selling him, given that he hasn't really fit in and done well there.

 

He's a pretty good age, only turning 31 in a few weeks (he's 1 year younger than Kennedy), and for those concerned about injuries it looks like he has no long term injuries and seems to rarely have injuries overall (also, over the past 4 seasons, he's played over 30 games a season, each with lots of minutes).

 

 

Across McDonald's career he's been a very consistent goal scorer, so he'd likely rip it up in the A-League. And he's a Melbourne boy. I think either him or Kennedy would make an excellent Australian marquee for next season, and I'd be pleased if we were to sign one of them.

Edited by Murfy1
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