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Melbourne City FC Player Theatrics / Simulation - Poll


Torn Asunder
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Melbourne City FC Player Theatrics / Simulation - Poll  

58 members have voted

  1. 1. Should Melbourne City FC publicly condemn its player for theatrics / simulation?

    • Yes, unconditionally
      26
    • No, its part of the game and the rules allow for it to be dealt with by the referees
      32


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6 minutes ago, Torn Asunder said:

Yep, condemn!  sorry for the error!  

All good. But even so it doesnt really address the issue that had been discussed. I dont think anyone was really discussing if the club should publicly say anything about simulation. I think the question should be "Do you think players should be punished (either during the game or retrospectively) for simulation?" 

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Amongst all the crap spouted by Aloisi about North, I seem to recall he actually said it was wrong, even followed by a big but.  I'm not sure we're even getting that half hearted condemnation.  I really don't like it, and it's bringing the game into disrepute.  Ideally I want it dealt with by referees and the match review panel, and backed up by the clubs with internal discipline.

But, JVS is right on this, referees must do more to protect creative players, and deal with the subtler forms of simulation, such as the dive that won Sydney's penalty.

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12 minutes ago, fensaddler said:

referees must do more to protect creative players, and deal with the subtler forms of simulation, such as the dive that won Sydney's penalty.

Refs aren't good enough to handle the subtleties of the game, the game has progressed but the refs haven't.

FFA needs to lure international refs to grow the game, it must be the next major investment imo.

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While I don't necessarily agree with the absoluteness of the two options, I am leaning much more in the yes camp than the no.

If nothing else the theatrics are embarrassing and cringeworthy, and for all the talk about how they "are part of the game" for mine they only detract from the spectacle and the reputation of the players.

And the reality is that they will hinder the sports ability to attract new supporters. I've brought many friends to Heart/City games throughout the years, and aside from the clubs complete inability to perform on anything close to a consistent basis nothing turns these guys off more than watching players make fools of themselves.

This poll will represent the opinions of those who are on here, but I'd suggest the next group of supporters to convert will be less willing to accept this as "part of the game", and considering that these people are not particularly eager to throw themselves into the sport issues like this only give them reasons not to jump onboard. It sounds like a weak reason to avoid the sport, but in my experience a big part of embracing a club/sport is finding players who you enjoy watching and feel a connection to and that connection is harder to build when you lose respect for a player.

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For me, its black and white; its either a public position of the club, or it is not ...

Aloisi came out pretty strong after the North incident and decried simulation.  If any of his players repeat North's actions, they would clearly be in contradiction to the manager.

JVS pretty much said the opposite, but he focused on fouls and player protection.  That is why I kept the poll straight down the line, because those two questions IMO represent the current state of affairs.

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Melb City should just focus on winning.

Play whatever way is needed to achieve success and if that means playing aggressive, and being theatrical to disrupt the flow of play, and being out of favour with the moronic media, then so be it.

History shows which teams were successful by the silverware they have obtained and not how nice or compliant they were. Do whatever is required to win as all the side show issues are just noise.

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8 minutes ago, Torn Asunder said:

For me, its black and white; its either a public position of the club, or it is not ...

Aloisi came out pretty strong after the North incident and decried simulation.  If any of his players repeat North's actions, they would clearly be in contradiction to the manager.

JVS pretty much said the opposite, but he focused on fouls and player protection.  That is why I kept the poll straight down the line, because those two questions IMO represent the current state of affairs.

I think JVS, without saying it publicly, is basically thinking that our players are getting the raw end of the deal (Bruno specifically). So this is his way of stubbornly giving the league a big fuck you that if the refs wont call fouls that are legitimate then our players will have to simulate contact to get them. 

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18 minutes ago, n i k o said:

I think JVS, without saying it publicly, is basically thinking that our players are getting the raw end of the deal (Bruno specifically). So this is his way of stubbornly giving the league a big fuck you that if the refs wont call fouls that are legitimate then our players will have to simulate contact to get them. 

I'll agree with you regarding Bruno, he's getting kicked week after week,

 

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21 minutes ago, playmaker said:

Play whatever way is needed to achieve success and if that means playing aggressive, and being theatrical to disrupt the flow of play, and being out of favour with the moronic media, then so be it.

Oh yeah... winning is all that matters. And you're calling the media and (looking at the poll) over a third of the posters on this forum moronic. 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Alexxxandro said:

 over a third of the posters on this forum moronic. 

 

 

Your words, not mine.

I don't give a rats how we win. At the end of the day when we are holding up the silverware I don't  think one supporter will care about how we played or how we got there or all the media click-bate scandals.

Winning is absolute, either you win the silverware or you don't, everything else is irrelevant.

Edited by playmaker
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16 hours ago, fensaddler said:

Amongst all the crap spouted by Aloisi about North, I seem to recall he actually said it was wrong, even followed by a big but.  I'm not sure we're even getting that half hearted condemnation.  I really don't like it, and it's bringing the game into disrepute.  Ideally I want it dealt with by referees and the match review panel, and backed up by the clubs with internal discipline.

But, JVS is right on this, referees must do more to protect creative players, and deal with the subtler forms of simulation, such as the dive that won Sydney's penalty.

In another thread I've pointed out that the FFA Disciplinary Regulations require the MRP to look at possible simulation incidents, especially those that lead to penalty kicks. Of course we don't get to see the full reports of the MRP, but the only incident mentioned publicly is that involving Matt Simon. Do we assume that the MRP has looked at the Brandan incident, the Bobo/Jakobsen incident, and other incidents, and found no cause for concern, or do we not? I think we have to assume that they have, otherwise the MRP is not doing its job.

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17 minutes ago, playmaker said:

 

Winning is absolute, either you win the silverware or you don't, everything else is irrelevant.

Nope not for me.

Winning is pretty important and at the end of the day the only true way of measuring success . But the way you do it is also important to me. Being dirty or cynical, being basically a cunt to win for me is going too far.

Winning and playing good attractive soccer is my hope. 

Of course there are margins and each to there own but I would enjoy success more if it's done the right way.

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4 minutes ago, Jovan said:

Nope not for me.

Winning is pretty important and at the end of the day the only true way of measuring success . But the way you do it is also important to me. Being dirty or cynical, being basically a cunt to win for me is going too far.

Winning and playing good attractive soccer is my hope. 

Of course there are margins and each to there own but I would enjoy success more if it's done the right way.

Fair enough.

 I don't see it that way, each to their own.

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10 minutes ago, Jovan said:

Nope not for me.

Winning is pretty important and at the end of the day the only true way of measuring success . But the way you do it is also important to me. Being dirty or cynical, being basically a cunt to win for me is going too far.

Winning and playing good attractive soccer is my hope. 

Of course there are margins and each to there own but I would enjoy success more if it's done the right way.

I would love to see the Dutch win the world cup,BUT I'm glad that they didn't win it in  South Africa in 2010 playing the thuggery brand of football that was on display.

 

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4 minutes ago, japiedog said:

I would love to see the Dutch win the world cup,BUT I'm glad that they didn't win it in  South Africa in 2010 playing the thuggery brand of football that was on display.

 

Perfect example. Also add any team managed by Mourinho.

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1 hour ago, Jovan said:

Perfect example. Also add any team managed by Mourinho.

You are kidding right? 

65% win percentage and in ten seasons of club management, he led his club to win its domestic league eight times, the UEFA Champions League twice and the UEFA Cup once. Between 2003 and 2012, Mourinho did not go a single calendar year without winning at least one trophy.

I wonder how many supporters of those teams are regretful of his time with them.

Edited by playmaker
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Fernando is a bit of a dick about it and he should be encouraged to stop.

Bruno justifiably tries to call attention to the jabs and niggles he gets when playing close, but now our opposition coaches have successfully gotten into the FFAs head and turned it into a boy who cried wolf scenario. Which is ironic, because Ivan gets carved up week in, week out and still gets no ref joy.

If the FFA is going to clamp down on perceived simulation, then it should also clamp down on what's leading to that.

Edited by AlbionLoveDen
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Quote

A-LEAGUE
A-League to clamp down on divers after Fernando Brandan’s ‘over-reaction’ for Melbourne City

20 hours ago
by TOM SMITHIES & MATT WINDLEY
Source: The Daily Telegraph

REFEREES, players and clubs are being urged to address the scourge of simulation in the A-League.

As Melbourne City coach John van ’t Schip revealed he had spoken to winger Fernando Brandan about his “overreacting”, A-League boss Greg O’Rourke called on everyone in the game to tackle cases of “deception”.

Brandan’s blatant gamesmanship was the third high-profile incident in 10 rounds, with the Argentine drawing derision on Friday night for holding his face after being pushed in the back of the head.


It came just a week after City themselves reacted furiously to Brisbane defender Jade North also holding his face and collapsing to the ground seconds after a brush from City captain Bruno Fornaroli.

Though questions were asked of several incidents in City’s 1-1 draw with Sydney FC on Friday night, including Sydney FC striker Bobo receiving only a yellow card for a high challenge on Ivan Franjic, Brandan’s theatrics were widely condemned, especially as City teammate Neil Kilkenny was guilty of a similar over-reaction in November.

Seven years ago the A-League became one of the few in the world with the power to punish fakers retrospectively.


A-League referees will be reminded this week by their bosses that they have the power to address simulation on the pitch with a yellow card, after none of Kilkenny, North or Brandan was cautioned.

The A-League’s match review panel can only address incidents of simulation involving a penalty, red card or goal. Technically FFA could cite a player for bringing the game into disrepute, but that is a process usually reserved for serious incidents.

But referees boss Ben Wilson has reiterated to club CEOs in recent days that the governing body can only do so much in combating an issue accepted in some football cultures but anathema to many Australian sports fans.


O’Rourke told The Daily Telegraph: ““FFA has made it clear that simulation is unacceptable. This message has been communicated consistently to clubs, players and coaches and the need to issue yellow cards for any instances of players trying to influence decisions through deception has been reinforced to the referees.”

Van’t Schip said he had spoken to his whole squad about avoiding simulation, and said referees could help Brandan assimilate.

“I want it to be very clear that we’re not supportive of the overreacting that he’s doing,” van’t Schip said.

“But it’s also that he’s only four months here. He’s a player that has been playing his whole life in Argentina in a way that is accepted there, so you can’t expect a player to change in one moment.


“We’ve been working on it, because we know that’s something in his game that needs to change.

“It doesn’t take away that when he gets fouled he has to get a free kick, but on top of that, the overreacting, it’s something he shouldn’t do.

“Because now it’s becoming something that, because he’s overreacting, they don’t give him a foul.

“That’s the judgement of a referee. Whistle for the foul, but you tell him also that this is not what we do here. Give him a yellow card maybe.”

“They’ve got a tough job because they need eyes everywhere, but that’s how they have to educate the player.”

Link to Fox Sports article

 

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7 minutes ago, n i k o said:

"That’s the judgement of a referee. Whistle for the foul, but you tell him also that this is not what we do here. Give him a yellow card maybe.”

Exactly what I said. So fucking simple. Move on. 

It is simple. And completely contradictory to "its part of the game"

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