Domestic Politics

[thisphantomfortress]

20 minutes ago, Tesla said:

Nick Xenophag already pursuing his anti-gambling agenda I see. Will be a massive blow to sport in this country if gambling advertising is banned. Might be a good thing for people like me since they can't replace the cash flow from a profitable gambler with some mug sports multi better so easily, but none the less it's a disgrace and I hope Labor havent gone so far to the left that they support this shit.

Though I'm glad he doesn't seem to be on top of what's happening with esports, clearly the bookmakers are targeting underage gamblers with their esport obsession in recent times. Dodgy cunts.

This message was NOT brought to you by CSGOlotto

[Tesla]

7 minutes ago, thisphantomfortress said:

This message was NOT brought to you by CSGOlotto

That stuff actually helps Australian bookmakers, the amount of gambling with "illegal offshore providers", as the Australian bookmaking industry likes to call it (really they mean "less taxed, less regulated, and therefore lower cost competition which has a smaller margin"), in esports would be pretty big and a lot of that would definitely be underage. Especially the skins betting, given some of those skins cost like $1,000, it is really no different to betting real money and I don't know why you would prefer that to a bookmaker unless you are underage (or doing some sort of arbitrage) .

The fact that people will just go bet with offshore bookmakers is pretty much the #1 argument that Australian bookmakers have as to why there shouldn't be more taxes/regulation/etc., and it's true. The big shots already bet with Asian/Carribean operators and would be putting more money through those operators than the Australian operators, which means the government is missing out on a fuckload of tax money.

[Tesla]

Where are all the anti-gun cunts now with all these car jacking going on? US gun laws are looking pretty good to me right now TBH.

Watch how quickly this Apex gang shit would come to an end if someone mowed down 3 car loads of urban youths with an AR15 while they were trying to jack him  

[GreenSeater]

4 minutes ago, Tesla said:

Where are all the anti-gun cunts now with all these car jacking going on? US gun laws are looking pretty good to me right now TBH.

Watch how quickly this Apex gang shit would come to an end if someone mowed down 3 car loads of urban youths with an AR15 while they were trying to jack him  

Ah yes, just like how guns have solved the gang issues in America?

[Tesla]

7 minutes ago, GreenSeater said:

Ah yes, just like how guns have solved the gang issues in America?

We don't have gang vs gang issues, we have a gang vs average law abiding citizen issues.

But you got me, my mistake was referring to the US in the first case. I should have referred to Switzerland instead where they have the highest gun ownership rate in the world but you never hear about mass shootings or gun crime. Or even much crime at all, you'd have to be mad to break into someone's house in a country where almost every house has a gun in it.

Or even NZ, they have much more liberal gun laws than Australia and you don't hear about mass shootings or much gun crime.

Edited July 19, 2016 by Tesla

[GreenSeater]

6 minutes ago, Tesla said:

We don't have gang vs gang issues, we have a gang vs average law abiding citizen issues.

But you got me, my mistake was referring to the US in the first case. I should have referred to Switzerland instead where they have the highest gun ownership rate in the world but you never hear about mass shootings or gun crime. Or even much crime at all, you'd have to be mad to break into someone's house in a country where almost every house has a gun in it.

Or even NZ, they have much more liberal gun laws than Australia and you don't hear about mass shootings or much gun crime.

Yeah I know there are examples of countries with loose gun laws that do just fine, but to be honest I see no need to change the system that's working perfectly. I think there are probably better ways to deal with the relatively minor issue of one gang than arming the populace.

[n i k o]

Regardless whether it's a gun or any other weapon the courts are designed to punish you and protect the intruder. If someone breaks into my house I will shoot them but I'll try to shoot them in the leg. I will still get punished if this were to occur and the intruder survives. Fucked up system. 

Edited July 19, 2016 by n i k o

[Tesla]

32 minutes ago, GreenSeater said:

Yeah I know there are examples of countries with loose gun laws that do just fine, but to be honest I see no need to change the system that's working perfectly. I think there are probably better ways to deal with the relatively minor issue of one gang than arming the populace.

Putting aside wether there would or wouldnt be negative consequences to higher gun ownership.

In the event that you were faced with 3 cars full of men who are intent on taking your property, doing severe damage to you that will at the very least leave you hospitalised, who also clearly don't care if you die as a result of their assault (and it's only a matter of time before that's how one of these car jackings ends), are you telling me you won't be wishing you had a way of defending yourself?

Believe me, i'm not a violent person, far from it in fact. I'm peaceful AF. I also would never break any laws that could see me in jail or with a criminal record, in normal circumstances. But if this shit happened to me I dont give a fuck, I'll kill them if I have to without hesitating even if it meant I would go to jail (as per current laws). Because regardless of what the laws say, I am 100% sure I am in the right. Unfortunately, that's extremely difficult without a firearm when you're up against 10 or so people. Most likely I reckon I'll be ramming my way out of the situation, probably destroy my car and probably run over a couple of them, but as long as I can get out of there I'm happy.

 

14 minutes ago, n i k o said:

Regardless whether it's a gun or any other weapon the courts are designed to punish you and protect the intruder. If someone breaks into my house I will shoot them but I'll try to shoot them in the leg. I will still get punished if this were to occur and the intruder survives. Fucked up system. 

Don't shoot them in the leg, they can still harm you. You have to neutralise the threat, shoot to kill.

Edited July 19, 2016 by Tesla

[thisphantomfortress]

48 minutes ago, Tesla said:

 

Or even NZ, they have much more liberal gun laws than Australia and you don't hear about mass shootings or much gun crime.

Nz is an agrarian society, their biggest city is 1/4 population and it's the size of Adelaide. The two situations are impossible to compare comprehensively.

Having lived there might be worth reading about the Mongrel Mob and Black Power too

[GreenSeater]

14 minutes ago, Tesla said:

Believe me, i'm not a violent person, far from it in fact. I'm peaceful AF. I also would never break any laws that could see me in jail or with a criminal record, in normal circumstances.

I do certainly agree that our self-defence laws in this country are poor, but the problem with looser gun control lies within this paragraph. The majority of people are just like you and peaceful. The problem lies within the small percentage of people that are not like you. I believe that guns don't kill people, people kill people, and I also don't believe that loose gun laws are the main issue that causes so many mass shootings in America. I believe that there will always be violent people out there regardless of the gunsituation. Just look at Nice. The bloke killed almost 100 people with a truck. In Germany today a bloke injured 10 people with a fucking axe. But I also believe that giving these people easier access to weapons that can easily kill dozens of people is a recipe for disaster. The problem that pro-gun people forget or ignore is that when good, peaceful, law-abiding citizens have easier access to guns to defend themselves with, the very people they are trying to protect themselves from have easier access to guns as well. I imagine that APEX would be a much bigger issue if they had access to guns.

Edited July 19, 2016 by GreenSeater

[Tesla]

4 minutes ago, thisphantomfortress said:

Nz is an agrarian society, their biggest city is 1/4 population and it's the size of Adelaide. The two situations are impossible to compare comprehensively.

Having lived there might be worth reading about the Mongrel Mob and Black Power too

It's a far more similar society than to Australia than the US is. In fact I remember not that long ago there was a study released that found Australia and NZ are so similar we might as well merge.

Our two biggest cities are more than 1/3rd our population, not that dissimilar to biggest city being 1/4.

[NewConvert]

51 minutes ago, n i k o said:

Regardless whether it's a gun or any other weapon the courts are designed to punish you and protect the intruder. If someone breaks into my house I will shoot them but I'll try to shoot them in the leg. I will still get punished if this were to occur and the intruder survives. Fucked up system. 

The only case I can think of was in the mid 80s when a Greek Milk Bar owner shot a youth who had broken into his milk bar again to steal. The owner was waiting with his gun and shot the 17 year old dead and then called the police. The milk bar owner was never charged because it was self defence but the police did confiscate his gun (can't remember what kind but I think it was a rifle) as evidence and he had to re-apply for his gun license. I haven't paid that much attention to self defence cases because they normally refer to "colourful" characters such as when Mick Gatto shot dead Andrew Vianemen i9n the self-defence and the jury believed him.

[HeartFc]

Well id love a gun these days, small caliber would be fine. A .45 for example would do the job when it comes to apex type situations, just pointing at them would be enough and if I did have to shoot, that'd likely survive. 

Im living in the hotbed of apex right now, Ive got mates who've been very close to being car jacked more than once and its getting worse every month. I hear the police copper over my house atleast once a week now and read of 2/3 robberies weekly. Its getting out of hand.

I'm not completely shitting myself but I do have weapons next to the  bed and in my car. Now if I get pulled over by a cop and he see's my golf club/baseball bat and I get fined or taken to court then Im gonna go zero to Timothy Mcviegh very quickly. 

[Jestr]

copper I know had told me, if the shit gets really nasty, only way to avoid jail is to ensure intruder is dead. Place a knife in his cold hand and boys in blue will call it self defence. You'll get pat on the back and hot donuts if you lucky. 

[Tesla]

13 minutes ago, HeartFc said:

Well id love a gun these days, small caliber would be fine. A .45 for example would do the job when it comes to apex type situations, just pointing at them would be enough and if I did have to shoot, that'd likely survive. 

Im living in the hotbed of apex right now, Ive got mates who've been very close to being car jacked more than once and its getting worse every month. I hear the police copper over my house atleast once a week now and read of 2/3 robberies weekly. Its getting out of hand.

I'm not completely shitting myself but I do have weapons next to the  bed and in my car. Now if I get pulled over by a cop and he see's my golf club/baseball bat and I get fined or taken to court then Im gonna go zero to Timothy Mcviegh very quickly. 

It's not just our your way but in my area as well, think it was last night when the latest incident occurred and it was in my area.

Problem is no weapon short of a firearm is scarring these blokes off, not when there are so many of them. Certainly not anything that wouldn't land me in trouble if I got pulled over by the police randomly. Btw a baseball bat could get you in trouble, at least bring a ball etc as well and have a story to make it seem legit. Still it won't help you in one of these car jacking situations.

[n i k o]

10 minutes ago, Tesla said:

It's not just our your way but in my area as well, think it was last night when the latest incident occurred and it was in my area.

Problem is no weapon short of a firearm is scarring these blokes off, not when there are so many of them. Certainly not anything that wouldn't land me in trouble if I got pulled over by the police randomly. Btw a baseball bat could get you in trouble, at least bring a ball etc as well and have a story to make it seem legit. Still it won't help you in one of these car jacking situations.

If you don't want to carry a knife the best one for the car is a snooker ball in an old football sock. Used to carry one in the car  many years back just in case. Can be hidden quite well as well but no garuntee whatsoever to help in a car jacking. 

[HeartFc]

57 minutes ago, Tesla said:

It's not just our your way but in my area as well, think it was last night when the latest incident occurred and it was in my area.

Problem is no weapon short of a firearm is scarring these blokes off, not when there are so many of them. Certainly not anything that wouldn't land me in trouble if I got pulled over by the police randomly. Btw a baseball bat could get you in trouble, at least bring a ball etc as well and have a story to make it seem legit. Still it won't help you in one of these car jacking situations.

Yeah it seems they're moved north and west a bit to try and keep the cops guessing. My mrs was taking cake of one of these clowns who was in the car that stacked on the west gate. Been in ICU for a while but unfortunately they've avoided major brain damage. 9 of em in one X5, wheres an explosion when you need one!

You're not wrong, a bat or club wont really help me too much but its a piece of mind thing. Ye im gonna get a mitt and ball just in case. My mate does the ol tackle box and fishing knife after he got followed through Endeavour Hills by Apex.

 

 

Edited July 19, 2016 by HeartFc

[Tesla]

What might work is pepper spray tbh, that shit is underrated, can take a few out quickly and it's highly unlikely they will die or anything serious (people actually have died from pepper spray fwiw). It's illegal just to carry it though so there is no story or anything getting you out of the legal consequences but it's easy to hide and it's not like these guys are going to report you to the police.

[Embee]

7 hours ago, Tesla said:

What might work is pepper spray tbh, that shit is underrated, can take a few out quickly and it's highly unlikely they will die or anything serious (people actually have died from pepper spray fwiw). It's illegal just to carry it though so there is no story or anything getting you out of the legal consequences but it's easy to hide and it's not like these guys are going to report you to the police.

Can confirm

Edited July 19, 2016 by Embee

[malloy]

9 hours ago, HeartFc said:

Well id love a gun these days, small caliber would be fine. A .45 for example would do the job when it comes to apex type situations, just pointing at them would be enough and if I did have to shoot, that'd likely survive. 

Im living in the hotbed of apex right now, Ive got mates who've been very close to being car jacked more than once and its getting worse every month. I hear the police copper over my house atleast once a week now and read of 2/3 robberies weekly. Its getting out of hand.

I'm not completely shitting myself but I do have weapons next to the  bed and in my car. Now if I get pulled over by a cop and he see's my golf club/baseball bat and I get fined or taken to court then Im gonna go zero to Timothy Mcviegh very quickly. 

I am perplexed as to what you would think a large calibre would be if you think a small calibre is a .45.....

Edit: were you also trying to say that if they got shot by the .45 they would likely survive?

Edited July 19, 2016 by malloy

[thisphantomfortress]

1 minute ago, Embee said:

Can confirm

How many times is it now you fucking crim?

[Shahanga]

Well I guess 1 solution is for the whole population to arm themselves and have loaded weapons on hand ready for use 24/7. Alternatively of course (radical idea though it is) the parliament, courts and police could just do their job and arrest lock up and/or deport these people. Wouldn't be that hard, just need The Will. I suspect Dan doesn't do something might find himself the ex premier.

[Deeming]

32 minutes ago, Shahanga said:

Well I guess 1 solution is for the whole population to arm themselves and have loaded weapons on hand ready for use 24/7. Alternatively of course (radical idea though it is) the parliament, courts and police could just do their job and arrest lock up and/or deport these people. Wouldn't be that hard, just need The Will. I suspect Dan doesn't do something might find himself the ex premier.

Absolutely.  Introduce 3 strikes policy. 

Take sentencing powers away from soft judges and magistrates. 

[HeartFc]

3 hours ago, malloy said:

I am perplexed as to what you would think a large calibre would be if you think a small calibre is a .45.....

Edit: were you also trying to say that if they got shot by the .45 they would likely survive?

sorry I meant 5mm but just farted out .45 (I'm assuming .45's are those are the big fuckers that fit in magnums?),  I don't know much about guns but I do recall stats showing most small calibre handgun shootings rarely result in fatalities. 

Since you seem to know a little a bit about them, is it legal to have a small calibre handgun in this country? Exceptions? Loopholes?

[Jimmy]

14 hours ago, Tesla said:

Switzerland instead where they have the highest gun ownership rate in the world

I'm pro guns (well freedom really) as anyone and I want something to shoot apex with but I don't think this is even close to right Tes.

[jw1739]

4 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

I'm pro guns (well freedom really) as anyone and I want something to shoot apex with but I don't think this is even close to right Tes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/nation/gun-homicides-ownership/table/

Edited July 20, 2016 by jw1739

[HeartFc]

12 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

I'm pro guns (well freedom really) as anyone and I want something to shoot apex with but I don't think this is even close to right Tes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

4th in the world. Close enough.

Edit: Dem serbs though!

Edited July 20, 2016 by HeartFc

[Tesla]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

I'm pro guns (well freedom really) as anyone and I want something to shoot apex with but I don't think this is even close to right Tes.

I come from the Pauline Hanson school of statistics.

 

17 minutes ago, HeartFc said:

sorry I meant 5mm but just farted out .45 (I'm assuming .45's are those are the big fuckers that fit in magnums?),  I don't know much about guns but I do recall stats showing most small calibre handgun shootings rarely result in fatalities. 

Since you seem to know a little a bit about them, is it legal to have a small calibre handgun in this country? Exceptions? Loopholes?

.50 are the huge ones that will go through like 4 human bodies in a row, or rip your arm off if you get shot in it, so a .45 isn't much smaller.

Edited July 20, 2016 by Tesla

[HeartFc]

Ok, well Ill take one of those .50 fuckers thanks. 4 humans is 1 car load of apex cunts, so prefect. 

[jw1739]

2 minutes ago, HeartFc said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

4th in the world. Close enough.

There is a qualification on the figure for Switzerland.

[Tesla]

1 minute ago, jw1739 said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/nation/gun-homicides-ownership/table/

What I meant was more the percentage of households that own a gun. The US' high number comes from people who own like 50 guns each, not necessarily that they have the highest percentage of households who own a gun. I'm not sure if such a statistic exists but I would imagine the Swiss and US would be much closer on that measure.

[Tesla]

3 hours ago, Shahanga said:

Well I guess 1 solution is for the whole population to arm themselves and have loaded weapons on hand ready for use 24/7. Alternatively of course (radical idea though it is) the parliament, courts and police could just do their job and arrest lock up and/or deport these people. Wouldn't be that hard, just need The Will. I suspect Dan doesn't do something might find himself the ex premier.

FWIW, one negative about more liberal gun laws is then you give the police a plausible excuse for fulfilling their underlying desire to kill people for fun. That's probably the only negative we see in the US that would be imported into Australia if we had more liberal gun laws.

Right now cops in Australia have to suppress their desire as they can't easily get away with it, if they killed you for LOLs and said you had a gun or even planted one on you people are going to be pretty suspicious, but if we had more liberal gun laws they could get away with it like they can in the US.

[malloy]

1 hour ago, HeartFc said:

sorry I meant 5mm but just farted out .45 (I'm assuming .45's are those are the big fuckers that fit in magnums?),  I don't know much about guns but I do recall stats showing most small calibre handgun shootings rarely result in fatalities. 

Since you seem to know a little a bit about them, is it legal to have a small calibre handgun in this country? Exceptions? Loopholes?

I have read that statistic somewhere too.  TBH if i thought my life was in enough dangrr to warrant using a firearm I would want to be using something that has a fair bit of stopping power.

Handguns are reasonably controlled in Australia and there are no loopholes/exceptions I am aware of.

Just a point to note the calibers are merely the width of the slug and whilst .50 in a hand gun is gonna do alot of damage it is by no means gonna do the same damage as a .50 rifle bullet.  Do a quick google search to see a comparison of the two.

[Deviant]

1 hour ago, Tesla said:

FWIW, one negative about more liberal gun laws is then you give the police a plausible excuse for fulfilling their underlying desire to kill people for fun. That's probably the only negative we see in the US that would be imported into Australia if we had more liberal gun laws.

Right now cops in Australia have to suppress their desire as they can't easily get away with it, if they killed you for LOLs and said you had a gun or even planted one on you people are going to be pretty suspicious, but if we had more liberal gun laws they could get away with it like they can in the US.

Most cops are scared of shooting people dude. Shit scared. They don't get enough time using the pistol. 

[Tesla]

There is a higher chance of me winning the lotto (even though I dont play) than me providing accurate information on the census now that names are stored.

In fact, I might exclude myself completely, as long as my household complete it I doubt they'll be an issue?

Government already has my voice print and so whenever I open my mouth they know where I am, not too mention all the data they would have extracted from my email and social media accounts, why the fuck do they need me to complete the census they probably know more about me than I know about myself.

Stay woke.

Edited July 21, 2016 by Tesla

[thisphantomfortress]

38 minutes ago, Tesla said:

There is a higher chance of me winning the lotto (even though I dont play) than me providing accurate information on the census now that names are stored.

In fact, I might exclude myself completely, as long as my household complete it I doubt they'll be an issue?

Government already has my voice print and so whenever I open my mouth they know where I am, not too mention all the data they would have extracted from my email and social media accounts, why the fuck do they need me to complete the census they probably know more about me than I know about myself.

Stay woke.

I heard jet fuel can't melt steel beams?

[Embee]

1 minute ago, thisphantomfortress said:

I heard jet fuel can't melt steel beams?

Your thoughts @Fingman?

[Tesla]

44 minutes ago, thisphantomfortress said:

I heard jet fuel can't melt steel beams?

While I'm clearly over-exaggerating, everything I said is certainly a possibility.

The government definitely does have my voice print, because I (in a moment of weakness) consented to it for verification purposes when calling the ATO.

As for hijacking the microphones of any mobile or similar device, wasn't that proven to happen in the US via the NSA leaks? (srs question, I didn't pay enough attention tbh, but I remember something along those lines). Do you think Zuckerberg has his macbook's microphone taped up for no reason (wasn't it also proven that FB and Google worked with the NSA on providing data and so someone like Zuckerberg would know what's going on better than most?)

As for the email and social media accounts being hacked by the government, that one was definitely proven (by the NSA leaks I believe, or similar), because it was done via an unreported hole in a common encryption algorithm (which the NSA or w/e agency it was purposely didn't report it so they could continue hacking whoever's email or social media accounts they wanted) and it was a huge thing when the hole was found.

It's funny how, even once they're confirmed, people refuse to believe conspiracy "theories". Don't get me wrong, I'm also usually the first to bag out nutjobs who believe in completely retarded and far fetched conspiracies, but once there is legitimate evidence it's a different story.

Australian security agencies work closely with their US counterparts. So it really isn't a stretch to imagine any of that is happening, and the only reason it wouldn't be happening is because there aren't enough resources to do it (and this is most likely the reality, and pretty much what I believe, that most this stuff probably isn't happening but only because there aren't enough resources). But the way things are going, and as more resources become available or it becomes cheaper to do, it only becomes more likely going forward.

Anyway, even if the risk is small, if I'm getting nothing out of it, why provide information I don't need to? Eg with the ATO and my voice print I was getting something out of it (convenience) so I didn't mind too much (and anyway there is nothing stopping some government department storing our voice print without consent regardless), but I don't get shit out of giving ABS my census data so why take the risk?

It's like how the average moron person trusts the police, so when they commit some minor crime through accident or negligence or because they didn't think it was a big deal, and the friendly police officer invites them for a 'chat' to 'clear up' the issue, they'll go in there and admit everything thinking it's okay because they're "not a criminal". Nekminut they are charged with a crime, because funnily enough a police officer's job is to collect evidence of crimes so they can be prosecuted. It happens every day. Why take the risk and provide them with information you dont have to?

Yes, I am cynical as fuck. Probably even borderline paranoid. But it doesn't hurt to be either of those things.

Edited July 21, 2016 by Tesla

[n i k o]

I find people that think that everything is as it seems more nuts than these nut job conspiracy theorists. To think there's not even a possibility of something being contrary to what a government and the media spouts is proof of how dumb society can be. That's not to say that there's major plots behind everything that goes on, sometimes shit just happens. Nothing wrong with keeping an open mind though. 

Edited July 21, 2016 by n i k o

[GreenSeater]

Tbh I don't think there's any illuminati type shit going on, but I think most of politics is probably similar to House of Cards full of backstabbing and sneaky deals and spying and shit.