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R23: WSW v City, Saturday March 30, 7.50pm, ANZ Stadium


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4 minutes ago, Imtellingyou said:

By having nearly all defenders line-up and still conceding three goals, possibly conclusion may be that we actually have a very weak defence. That's another not implemented 'cultural change '. In the same time we have Bart as the last line commander, who is arguably individually the best A-league defender. So much puzzles around our boring pitch display. 

We don't have a weak defence, we have a weak attack which just invites twice as much pressure on our defence.

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6 minutes ago, Mr MO said:

 

9 minutes ago, malloy said:

We don't have a weak defence, we have a weak attack which just invites twice as much pressure on our defence.

 

And the proof of that was the Perth game. 2-0 up because we attacked, then tried to defend the lead and lost it. Our best form of defence has been to keep the opposition pinned back by attacking them. 

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29 minutes ago, fensaddler said:

And the proof of that was the Perth game. 2-0 up because we attacked, then tried to defend the lead and lost it. Our best form of defence has been to keep the opposition pinned back by attacking them. 

I believe it was Johan Cruyff who once said “the best form of defence is attacking”

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41 minutes ago, malloy said:

We don't have a weak defence, we have a weak attack which just invites twice as much pressure on our defence.

Spot on. In recent matches we have had almost no attack whatsoever. "Toothless" was the adjective applied to us in the WSW match. Add to that a midfield that almost always looks to go sideways or backwards, and we're simply inviting non-stop pressure on our backline. We have a very good backline for the A-League, but pretty much any backline in the world is going to crack when subjected to non-stop pressure for 90 minutes.

Why our coaching staff cannot see this beggars belief. Everyone else can.

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1 hour ago, Imtellingyou said:

There was no non-stop pressure as we had the most of possession.  Middlefield is where pressure is soaked up. 

I think what JW is saying is that the ball moves sideways, slowly and indirect, and the team presses high. So yes, we have more possession but we have less opportunity to score.

Therefore when the error is made in possession, the defence is vulnerable to the counter attack.

It's a tactical and positional problem rather than a player quality problem.

What is happening, is that the defence is doing its job in the build up but the tactics don't allow for the quick ball movement into the attacking corridors therefore the real scoring opportunities are lost and then the defence becomes weak by taking possession in an advanced position.

The team has been badly managed.

The chemistry and creativity has been beaten out of the squad.

 

 

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15 minutes ago, playmaker said:

I think what JW is saying is that the ball moves sideways, slowly and indirect, and the team presses high. So yes, we have more possession but we have less opportunity to score.

Therefore when the error is made in possession, the defence is vulnerable to the counter attack.

It's a tactical and positional problem rather than a player quality problem.

What is happening, is that the defence is doing its job in the build up but the tactics don't allow for the quick ball movement into the attacking corridors therefore the real scoring opportunities are lost and then the defence becomes weak by taking possession in an advanced position.

The team has been badly managed.

The chemistry and creativity has been beaten out of the squad.

Precisely.

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Because we play so many sideways balls, our midfield and attacking lines are very square. Any loss of possession instantly removes that whole line of players in defensive transition, this adds to the pressure on the remaining defenders and invites an overload. The opposite happens in attack where player movement off the ball is so poor that there are few forward passing options, only sideways or backwards. Poor movement off the ball allows the opposition to constrict space. As we all say, this is a coaching problem. If Wazza is there yelling at the players from the sidelines, what the fuck is he doing with them during the week? Probably skin folds and beep tests.

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On 31/03/2019 at 0:28 PM, Mr MO said:

Yup, imagine last season not having Arzani then we there wouldn't have been many Joyce doubters at the start of the season.

Or you could look at it another way: if it wasn’t for Joyce, we could have had a front 3 of Brandan/Bruno/ Arzani last season. With Kilkenny in the middle and Cahill coming off the bench.

Oh what should’ve been.

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2 hours ago, belaguttman said:

Because we play so many sideways balls, our midfield and attacking lines are very square. Any loss of possession instantly removes that whole line of players in defensive transition, this adds to the pressure on the remaining defenders and invites an overload. The opposite happens in attack where player movement off the ball is so poor that there are few forward passing options, only sideways or backwards. Poor movement off the ball allows the opposition to constrict space. As we all say, this is a coaching problem. If Wazza is there yelling at the players from the sidelines, what the fuck is he doing with them during the week? Probably skin folds and beep tests.

Exactly what I've been thinking. He is coaching on game day as if he's yelling at a team of U8s who need to be constantly told which foot to put after the other. FFS, we're talking about a professional senior side who should have been coached within an inch of lives during the week so that on game day it's pretty much auto pilot with a positional tweak here or there. The guys a numbskull.

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I've said this before but this bloke has just got his basics wrong. 

He plays mostly with 4 at the back 2 holders and 1 forward mid that's generally used as forward presser rather than a play maker. Then he plays with generally 3 forward players that is 1 target man and 2 narrow winger types.

This essentially is a pretty stock standard approach and with the right movement can be good to watch but the fundamental problem with the way Wazza executes it is that both fullbacks are always too deep. 

This system requires both, yes both fullbacks being beyond the midfield in forward positions looking for those channel balls and overlapping the narrow wingers.

What we do is have our fullbacks behind the ball or more often enough involved in the build-up. Therefore the problem is then we end up having 6 or 7 players behind the ball and having zero opportunity to play fast forward balls so we end up playing safe ponderous side to side shit that is hard to watch and easy to defend.

We need to basically take more  risks and put more players beyond the ball than behind it during build up play.

Since day 1 he has been a stubborn defensive fuck nugget that has sapped any creativity and replaced it with a rigid flawed mantra.

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18 hours ago, HEARTinator said:

Exactly what I've been thinking. He is coaching on game day as if he's yelling at a team of U8s who need to be constantly told which foot to put after the other. FFS, we're talking about a professional senior side who should have been coached within an inch of lives during the week so that on game day it's pretty much auto pilot with a positional tweak here or there. The guys a numbskull.

parallels what maldini said about defending. if he had to make a tackle he had already made a mistake.  The more a coach has to yell on game day,  the worse hes doing at his job on the training park.

18 hours ago, Jovan said:

I've said this before but this bloke has just got his basics wrong. 

He plays mostly with 4 at the back 2 holders and 1 forward mid that's generally used as forward presser rather than a play maker. Then he plays with generally 3 forward players that is 1 target man and 2 narrow winger types.

This essentially is a pretty stock standard approach and with the right movement can be good to watch but the fundamental problem with the way Wazza executes it is that both fullbacks are always too deep. 

This system requires both, yes both fullbacks being beyond the midfield in forward positions looking for those channel balls and overlapping the narrow wingers.

What we do is have our fullbacks behind the ball or more often enough involved in the build-up. Therefore the problem is then we end up having 6 or 7 players behind the ball and having zero opportunity to play fast forward balls so we end up playing safe ponderous side to side shit that is hard to watch and easy to defend.

We need to basically take more  risks and put more players beyond the ball than behind it during build up play.

Since day 1 he has been a stubborn defensive fuck nugget that has sapped any creativity and replaced it with a rigid flawed mantra.

i disagree somewhat with this evaluation, if he plays a back 4, he plays a 4-4-2.  He only switched to 4-3-3 once wales and mcgree came on against wsw for example.  He tends to get the midfielders in the 4-4-2 to play as a triangle with the fourth mid stepping outside to press wide (the other wide mid stepping in to complete the triangle). 

Against wsw he played 3-5-2 and has done for most of the season. Why I believe it wrong is as follows:

 It was clear that delbridge doesn't have the aerobic or tactical capacity to play that position for 90 mins, all you have to do is compare him to RDL.   see in 3-5-2, the wing backs need to both press and defend their side depending if the ball is or is not on their side.  the other '4' defenders then shuffle and tuck over to create that back 4. As the wing back (lets say Delbo) presses as would a winger, RDL tucks across to play now as a right back.  The two wing backs should be constantly balancing the other out while we dont have the ball.  When we do have the ball, that is when both wing backs need to step high and wide to open the field and allow the cbs to play.  RDL does this great 9/10 times which is fine. 

Delbo, i watched, and struggled to fulfil both these roles (the second goal being his fault as he was 5 meters behind the winger - too slow to track back and fill in the lb position of the 'back four').  This inability to do this hinders our ability going forward and also pressing high up the field.  In attack, he wasnt as high or wide as he should've been - consequently allowing WSW to focus on the top 2 and the middle where the ball remained.  In defence, Shayon and Florin were forced to drop as they didn't  have the help to press from the wingbacks. This allowed WSW to play out easier the longer the game went on.

And in addition, to play a 3-5-2, you must have the LCB and RCB able to play football and create play.  In possession, the wing backs are pushed so high and wide as to allow for the cbs to have the space to attack space and play piercing balls.  Bart performs perfectly at this.  Good is complete dogshit. Every ball he gets that goes forward is long and to WSW or goes out.  La Rocca is equally dogshit - but he isn't the one responsible to play out, good and Bart are as they have the space provided by the Wingbacks pushing.  

The only time in the game we actually 'got out' and got forward was WSW turnovers in midfield.  Good cant pass, Bart isn't given anything when he goes forward.  RDL was average, Delbo was unfit. 

And Ill say it once again, Brattan cannot play that advanced midfielder by himself.  He either drops too deep to get the ball or is not mobile enough to actually play in between the lines (we should've kept caceres).  Florian and Shayon were as isolated upfront as Tom Hanks was in Castaway.  Let alone the total lack of impact our wing backs had in attack which stifled our forwards.  Start Mcgree and Drop Rostyn (after his shite performance). Let Baccus play DM (the commentators said he was statistically one of, if not, the most effective tacklers in the league - sold).  It seems so f***ing clear to me that these are issues, yet they happen time and time again.  

Sorry for the essay, hope I have got my point across

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1 hour ago, Torn Asunder said:

players looked very flat and tired ... they were potentially over trained in the lead up, and just simply pushed too hard.  Explains JMac's concussion ....

With a week off, they should have been humming and sharp as a tack

Yeah but they all have the lowest skin folds in the league. 

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1 hour ago, Torn Asunder said:

players looked very flat and tired ... they were potentially over trained in the lead up, and just simply pushed too hard.  Explains JMac's concussion ....

With a week off, they should have been humming and sharp as a tack

I've being saying this for the whole season. These guys are professional footballers. They may lose a little bit of match sharpness over a short lay-off, but with our long pre-season all but the latest arrivals should be fit and ready for the start of the season. After that it's just maintenance training. Over-training simply leaves them tired and brain dead. It's the same in any occupation that involves endless repetition - people just become sluggish and disinterested.

Joyce got away with this sort of crap as a youth coach at Manchester, because he had an endless supply of aspiring young hopefuls  - he could piss as many off as he liked and still have a waiting queue. He can't do that with us.

But, I'll say it again. He's done what he's done because it's been, at the very least, condoned by every manager in the line above him up to Al Mubarak. Not one of those people has put a stop to it. They are all incompetent and guilty in my book. A fish rots from the head.

Apparently Maclaren was hit on the side of the head by the ball. We don't know the details, but it wasn't repetitive heading of the ball in this case.

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RDL shouldn’t even be signed in the first place, only reason he was signed is because Joyce had kept close contact with him since he was 16.....all respect, he’s bang in a few and assisted some but a RB marquee in the HAL is a terrible decision, and to make things even worse signing guys like Berenguer doesn’t help either ....never thought I’d say this but Florin makes Budzinski look like a world class import ... #JoyceOut 

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19 minutes ago, Afif Adam said:

RDL shouldn’t even be signed in the first place, only reason he was signed is because Joyce had kept close contact with him since he was 16.....all respect, he’s bang in a few and assisted some but a RB marquee in the HAL is a terrible decision, and to make things even worse signing guys like Berenguer doesn’t help either ....never thought I’d say this but Florin makes Budzinski look like a world class import ... #JoyceOut 

Full disclosure: I was joking & your synopsis is spot on.

Fold the fucking club. Never to return to what we had it seems.

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25 minutes ago, JMSTEP123 said:

Budzinski got some decent results but was never played. Florin has got few results but seems to be first name on the sheet.

#Joycethings

Here lies the issue if he likes you you play regardless of how you perform and for 80% of the squad there has been no pressure to perform in fear of replacement. 

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7 hours ago, AXIOM said:

Here lies the issue if he likes you you play regardless of how you perform and for 80% of the squad there has been no pressure to perform in fear of replacement. 

Here lies one of many issues. This is a troubling one.

7 hours ago, Originalmeme said:

statistically, marcin was our best ever signing.  His minutes to goals/ assists ratio was nuts.  Poor bloke, he seemed like a great guy

What could have been!

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On 01/04/2019 at 4:15 PM, playmaker said:

I think what JW is saying is that the ball moves sideways, slowly and indirect, and the team presses high. So yes, we have more possession but we have less opportunity to score.

Therefore when the error is made in possession, the defence is vulnerable to the counter attack.

It's a tactical and positional problem rather than a player quality problem.

What is happening, is that the defence is doing its job in the build up but the tactics don't allow for the quick ball movement into the attacking corridors therefore the real scoring opportunities are lost and then the defence becomes weak by taking possession in an advanced position.

The team has been badly managed.

The chemistry and creativity has been beaten out of the squad.

 

 

You know what playmaker? I don’t agree with you on appointments but you are spot on here. The way we move the ball allows teams to ready themselves for us. Our time for attack passes by time and again with either poor decision or poor tactics. 

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