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What needs to be done to grow the support and attendance


Dylan
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19 hours ago, fensaddler said:

We should avoid at all costs trying to make City more geographically specific. It would undoubtedly be welcomed by supporters living in that part of town, but it would potentially put offside many of those who didn't. If that was combined with an out of centre stadium you would definitely compound that loss. For example, if City decided they were a northern suburbs club but stayed at AAMI, as a fan based towards Geelong I'd probably still attend, but I'd feel more than a little unwanted. Play in the north, and my attendance would be in jeopardy, certainly on a regular basis. If a club then opened in Geelong, all bets would then be off. 

We want to be one of Everton or Liverpool, not Tranmere Rovers (fabulous as local clubs like Tranmere are, that's aiming too low, especially when our rivals expect to be one of the big two in the city). I've enough faith in CFG that if Victory are going to be one of those big two, then they aim to be the other. We aim to be a club for the whole of Melbourne. 

Completely agree. After four years as Heart followed by four years as City it would simply be starting yet again to move matches from AAMI and/or re-identify the club to a specific area of Melbourne. To put it bluntly, we've endured enough change and disappointment already, and it's just going to piss people off even more to have any more. If we had on-field success, perhaps we could tolerate further change, but being the chokers we are the club is bloody lucky that we've stuck with it so far.

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On 15/05/2018 at 1:07 PM, malloy said:

Im not disagreeing with anything you are saying, boutique stadiums are fine for Australia, what I am saying is building stadiums, including boutique ones, is well out of the financial capacity of A-League clubs. 

Yes the $24 million is a huge amount, but it is well short of the funding the team will require due to the stadium being part of their plans. 

They are relying on $124M from the state government for the stadium, similar to the Tassie bid. 

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37 minutes ago, belaguttman said:

Perhaps this is just a projective psychological test, a football Rorscarch, but now that I've seen it I can't un-see the sign behind her on the wall that looks a lot like 'seco cunts'

I hadn't seen that. I was still trying to find the pigeon. Looks more like a chicken to me.

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2 hours ago, fensaddler said:

You drive a Tesla. You are the authority figure... 

I think that you're confusing Tesla with Jaguar or Mercedes:tooth:

Authority figures don't drive a car with 'Ludicrous Mode', nor with a stereo that goes to 11.

Edited by belaguttman
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Up until now I've always been against changing the song. But I now think we really need to get something that is unique to us, has got some real passion behind it and into which the crowd can put some real heart and soul.

Like the Hamburg anthem.

"When I'm away,
Be it in Juve or in Rome,
I think of Hamburg, my pearl,
And sing: Home, Sweet, Home.”

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10 hours ago, belaguttman said:

I think that you're confusing Tesla with Jaguar or Mercedes:tooth:

Authority figures don't drive a car with 'Ludicrous Mode', nor with a stereo that goes to 11.

I'm not sufficiently familiar with the details, but I love the idea of a vehicle engineering team who sign off a stereo that goes to 11, with a knowing wink towards Nigel Tufnell. 

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I think people should finally lay off the "bring the Heart colors back" blabla. It will never happen. And why would it happen? If I purchased something, I'd put the colors I want. I think CFG have been generous enough to allow us to have our away kits as red & white. First things first, win friggen something meaningful! FFA Cup is not good enough. Reach out to local clubs, give free tickets to juniors only if accompanied by an adult, some publicity would be nice i.e. billboards around Melbourne, reduce the Active Support seating area as we are not MV. Looks shit when you have 2 out of 3 empty bays and other members are not allowed to go near them. And possibly reduce the membership until we get some decent support and momentum.

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1 hour ago, Tony999 said:

I think people should finally lay off the "bring the Heart colors back" blabla. It will never happen. And why would it happen? If I purchased something, I'd put the colors I want. I think CFG have been generous enough to allow us to have our away kits as red & white. First things first, win friggen something meaningful! FFA Cup is not good enough. Reach out to local clubs, give free tickets to juniors only if accompanied by an adult, some publicity would be nice i.e. billboards around Melbourne, reduce the Active Support seating area as we are not MV. Looks shit when you have 2 out of 3 empty bays and other members are not allowed to go near them. And possibly reduce the membership until we get some decent support and momentum.

If you want to lay off the colours bit, then you might as well lock this thread and throw it away. I understand what you're saying, but IMO it's one of the key things that CFG did that made it harder to differentiate between City and Victory. I'd be very interested to know what percentage of full-season ticket holders actually started with the club in the Heart years as opposed to those who started in the City years.

As for the advertising, there was a great deal of advertising when Cahill joined the club. Every second or third bus shelter had an advertisement for the club. Didn't make a great deal of difference.

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Don't know how much more the Club can do TBH. They're all over the place at junior level, helping clubs and schools out. They have a coaching setup at my son's club and they're not even npl. OTOH, i haven't seen a single thing from victory promoting football from the grass roots level.

Answer might sound petty and naive, but it's quite simple: get rid of that fukn clown Gallop. He has no interest in promoting the sport and hence there are no clear pathways for juniors - especially when the top league in our country has turned into a joke. 

The buck stops with him. He should just Fuk off because everything he touches turns to shit.

Get someone in who cares about the above and you'll see the supporters start to flock back to the clubs.

 

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56 minutes ago, rass said:

Don't know how much more the Club can do TBH. They're all over the place at junior level, helping clubs and schools out. They have a coaching setup at my son's club and they're not even npl. OTOH, i haven't seen a single thing from victory promoting football from the grass roots level.

Answer might sound petty and naive, but it's quite simple: get rid of that fukn clown Gallop. He has no interest in promoting the sport and hence there are no clear pathways for juniors - especially when the top league in our country has turned into a joke. 

The buck stops with him. He should just Fuk off because everything he touches turns to shit.

Get someone in who cares about the above and you'll see the supporters start to flock back to the clubs.

Well said mate. One thing we can't do is fault Sue Crow and her team at "City in the Community."  Same with Joe and the Academy. The club is doing its very best in these areas.

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1 hour ago, jw1739 said:

If you want to lay off the colours bit, then you might as well lock this thread and throw it away. I understand what you're saying, but IMO it's one of the key things that CFG did that made it harder to differentiate between City and Victory. I'd be very interested to know what percentage of full-season ticket holders actually started with the club in the Heart years as opposed to those who started in the City years.

As for the advertising, there was a great deal of advertising when Cahill joined the club. Every second or third bus shelter had an advertisement for the club. Didn't make a great deal of difference.

I'm just over the colors bullshit. Like I said before, I'll wear pink just give me success. 

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There's been so many positives when looking back over the clubs history. But the club has simply made too many fuck ups also which are magnified on top of unsuccessful results. Whether with colour identity, Manchester links, player departures, coaching issues, playing style, being less successful for 8 years to our rivals (prob the biggest one). 

If we can learn from the past, avoid these fuck ups, have a distinct playing style that is 'our style' and become synonymous with success over the course of a few seasons then we will without doubt grow our support and our attendances. 

 

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55 minutes ago, n i k o said:

There's been so many positives when looking back over the clubs history. But the club has simply made too many fuck ups also which are magnified on top of unsuccessful results. Whether with colour identity, Manchester links, player departures, coaching issues, playing style, being less successful for 8 years to our rivals (prob the biggest one). 

If we can learn from the past, avoid these fuck ups, have a distinct playing style that is 'our style' and become synonymous with success over the course of a few seasons then we will without doubt grow our support and our attendances. 

 

Agree with most of this, although the playing style thing has always been one that intrigues me. For me, i just want us to win. Obv attacking football is nicer than defensive but given the choice it isnt a hard one for me, and secondary to that, attacking football can come in so many guises (see Leicester v City v Barcelona). A distinct style is kinda irrelevant to me personally, unless its park the bus stuff, which we've never done (even R 1-5, which was defensive, but hardly park bus category).

In saying that, that's a personal opinion and i'm aware there are some people who are obsessed with style etc (see Okon fanboys) and care about it more than results somewhat.

Edited by bt50
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22 minutes ago, bt50 said:

Agree with most of this, although the playing style thing has always been one that intrigues me. For me, i just want us to win. Obv attacking football is nicer than defensive but given the choice it isnt a hard one for me, and secondary to that, attacking football can come in so many guises (see Leicester v City v Barcelona). A distinct style is kinda irrelevant to me personally, unless its park the bus stuff, which we've never done (even R 1-5, which was defensive, but hardly park bus category).

In saying that, that's a personal opinion and i'm aware there are some people who are obsessed with style etc (see Okon fanboys) and care about it more than results somewhat.

Yeh looking back at the past I would trade the 'attractive' football for trophies. Separating personal preference to what the general public is attracted to though I do think how you win matters a lot in this league, in the Australian landscape and especially in Melbourne. Give people something that'll excite them with success and they'll come and watch. Give them something that for 80 minutes bores them but gives them success won't cut it entirely. And we'll be left scratching our heads how we though success would solve our problems. That's my personal opinion anyway and I could very well be wrong cause Melbourne (and people in general) also loves to get behind a winner. 

 

Edit: I say this with the proviso that we win trophies as the underlying non negotiable condition 

Edited by n i k o
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11 minutes ago, bt50 said:

Agree with most of this, although the playing style thing has always been one that intrigues me. For me, i just want us to win. Obv attacking football is nicer than defensive but given the choice it isnt a hard one for me, and secondary to that, attacking football can come in so many guises (see Leicester v City v Barcelona). A distinct style is kinda irrelevant to me personally, unless its park the bus stuff, which we've never done (even R 1-5, which was defensive, but hardly park bus category).

In saying that, that's a personal opinion and i'm aware there are some people who are obsessed with style etc (see Okon fanboys) and care about it more than results somewhat.

IMO style is important in that it's linked to excitement, and I think you need excitement to bring the fans to the game. Excitement is important at both the club level and the overall league level. Even though 2017-18 was our best league finish, IMO our most exciting season was when we had Fornaroli, Mooy and Novillo all banging in the goals. You can take me to a concert featuring the most technically-accomplished singer in the world, but if he or she delivers a program of funeral dirges then I'm not going to go again. Similarly football. There's no question in my mind that the excitement level at City and throughout the league has gone down.

To deliver excitement you need exciting players. That's why I think the FFA handbrake needs to come off in terms of squads and caps. Also why I'm waiting with interest to see who we sign during this off-season. It's not going to do anything positive for memberships and attendances if all we do is sign recycled A-League players. No offence to the players themselves, but we won't see growth if we sign the likes of La Rocca, Muscat, Bozanic, Vidosic, Malik etc. all over again.

As @n i k o says, for City (and several other clubs such as Central Coast and Phoenix) when you also have a lack of success it really is inevitable that interest in the club will wane.

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To add to this you only need to look at Sydney and you're left scratching your head how a team that has scored so many goals and has been so dominant still gets a bad rap at times on how exciting they've been. Even Ernie Merrick (even though through bitterness) commented negatively on the style that the tards won the final with. I am in full agreeance with @bt50 about the wank fest over Okon, but add on top of those other points that that is also a sign that to so many people in this country, style matters a lot. 

Edited by n i k o
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Yep i suppose i'm a person that is intrigued by tactics and approaches to games, at least at a basic level, so i find caginess etc to be an enthralling arm wrestle. That's obv not how everyone sees it, and obv as a neutral that can be harder to watch too.
Tbh its clearly obv style plays a much bigger part in people's perceptions of the game, and conversely interest levels than it would for me personally, i guess i kinda think the factor is also a bit overstated too when it comes to metrics though. IMO the effect of a negative style is more echoed in sentiment than actual attendances and eyes watching if its actually producing results.

Anyways, i kinda went slightly off topic with what i was getting at; that a distinctive style (a la barca etc) is what means nothing to me as opposed to simply attacking v defensive etc

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23 hours ago, jw1739 said:

Up until now I've always been against changing the song. But I now think we really need to get something that is unique to us, has got some real passion behind it and into which the crowd can put some real heart and soul.

Like the Hamburg anthem.

"When I'm away,
Be it in Juve or in Rome,
I think of Hamburg, my pearl,
And sing: Home, Sweet, Home.”

Swap Manchester for Hamburg and CFG will be all over this!

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The game style delusion continues I see. The pretty football argument will never stack up at this level. 

The only way we will succeed at anything is by winning, anything else is just a distraction.

Wazza has the right idea and let's just hope he gets the players to execute the plan. If not we get Merrick the next season.

 

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12 minutes ago, Imtellingyou said:

Hardcore football fans have already chosen Melbourne side. Only mega name, like Villa was, can make the difference. 

You are very right on this mate, but I would say there may be at least 5k that aren't affiliated with either club and hate victory but aren't impressed with us yet. The danger is with a third team in Melbourne is that we will be disadvantaged the most and potential growth will be hampered significantly.

That's my theory anyway.

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7 hours ago, playmaker said:

The game style delusion continues I see. The pretty football argument will never stack up at this level. 

The only way we will succeed at anything is by winning, anything else is just a distraction.

Wazza has the right idea and let's just hope he gets the players to execute the plan. If not we get Merrick the next season.

 

Obviously. Winning = Success. That's not rocket science.

I could guess what you're meaning but maybe you can explain what point you have made and how it ties in with our attendances....

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2 hours ago, n i k o said:

Obviously. Winning = Success. That's not rocket science.

I could guess what you're meaning but maybe you can explain what point you have made and how it ties in with our attendances....

Well that's what the thread is about isn't it?

No need to guess as the title of the thread is quite clear, well for some anyway, and understanding my point isn't rocket science either yet you failed miserably. 

Not surprising.

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20 minutes ago, playmaker said:

Well that's what the thread is about isn't it?

No need to guess as the title of the thread is quite clear, well for some anyway, and understanding my point isn't rocket science either yet you failed miserably. 

Not surprising.

Its just your inability to make a valid point. Winning will lead to success in terms of trophies to a certain extent but I don't think it will deliver the results you would think without being exciting. Why don't you explain yourself better. 

 

@Dylan delivered 

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11 hours ago, playmaker said:

The game style delusion continues I see. The pretty football argument will never stack up at this level. 

The only way we will succeed at anything is by winning, anything else is just a distraction.

Wazza has the right idea and let's just hope he gets the players to execute the plan. If not we get Merrick the next season.

I think we're talking about the importance of our matches being exciting whatever style we play rather than us playing pretty football.

There's no single magic bullet to improve growth. Winning is of course important, but it alone won't do the trick. We need excitement because we're not competing only against another A-League club, or only against several other spectator sports, we're competing in a very competitive entertainment/leisure broad-spectrum market.

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On 19/05/2018 at 10:03 PM, jw1739 said:

Winning is of course important, but it alone won't do the trick

That's where I disagree.

In this environment with a dominant powerhouse as our adversary and the potential of the another competitor vying for market share, our team's on-field success in the next few seasons

IS EVERYTHING 

if membership growth is a priority.

Everything else is just noise.

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We need to be consistently better than Victory, for a start. The opposite has been true for all but - what - two years of our existence? Why would new A-League supporters sign with City, rather than Victory for next season? We don't have too many obvious competitive advantages.

I'm also very turned off by the scheduling. From memory, our earliest home kick off time this season was 4:30pm. Not coincidentally, with a young family, that was the only game all season that I was able to attend. If you want families to come, balance out the start times.

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