Rd. 8 vs Perth, Friday 24/11, AAMI Park, 7.50 pm

[moops]

2 hours ago, jw1739 said:

Weren't you going to give him until Christmas? I must say that the outlook is beginning to look gloomy, but we'll know for sure by Christmas.

I'm still not prepared to blame our Manager for everything, because IMO our recruitment is well below par. I don't see why we continue to sign rejects from other A-League clubs (mainly Adelaide and Phoenix), and I don't understand the logic behind Budski. So IMO plenty sits on Petrillo's shoulders.

We're consistently doing well in youth development, and I agree with those who'd rather see our younger players given a good chance.

Agree, it's all about ballance, look at how much better CCM are playing now they have a better balance.

No offense to Muscat, but I would rather a young player come in, playing limited journey men is excepting mediocrity, they won't push on like Fitzy has and actually start to improve the whole team.

It won't always come off and there needs a bit of ruthlessness when after some time it doesn't, but I would rather take the risk in unearthing the next Petratos, McGree or Mooy.

People keep saying that we have the best youth in the country, but we are probably the worst in giving opportunities to players.

Kenny Lowe said something interesting in the press conference, that he wasn't given the opportunity to play first team football until he was 28 and never amounted to much because of it and that starting the younger players lately had opened his eyes to giving them more of a go than he had in the past.

It is a risk and there needs to be balance, but some can pleasantly surprise. It could encourage someone like Kamau to work harder to improve himself if he sees an Arzani, Crowley or Najjarine running about while he sits on the bench, he seems in a rut atm.

Anyway I was a bit drunk on Friday and not happy at all with how we started, credit to the boys in the second half, we looked like we had the numerical advantage rather than them.

 But Bella is right, it's all a bit add hock and predictable. We are still in third, nice to see the tards well below us, the trumpet was great again as well.

[jeffplz]

Tbh we got smacked but that first half was entertaining as fuck. rain pumped me up nicely

[japiedog]

We were shiteful the first half, we deserved to go in at half time trailing. ok VAR and Ref were a puzzle, but we deserved to be behind, we offered nothing going forward

I don't know what  Wazza was thinking playing Fitzy at RB, got found out more than a lying pollie

can kiss goodbye to winning the league

[MXG]

10 hours ago, Dylan said:

Mate you have got no hope of Wazza turning this around. This is all his doing, its taken a grand total of 4 rounds for this new 'culture' to fall apart. 

That would be disappointing. Personally for me it was a bad sign of weakness to see Galekovich on Friday. But coach knows more. Let's hope for the best. After all we do not support this Club for won trophies, right?   Hope is pretty much the only thing we had all these years.

[moops]

5 hours ago, japiedog said:

We were shiteful the first half, we deserved to go in at half time trailing. ok VAR and Ref were a puzzle, but we deserved to be behind, we offered nothing going forward

I don't know what  Wazza was thinking playing Fitzy at RB, got found out more than a lying pollie

can kiss goodbye to winning the league

Yeah, terrible!

Watching AU v WSW makes it even more apparent, AU look good value, if they had a good striker they would be a top 3 team, probably 2, Kurze is a good coach.

Should have gone local or German, they have a similar mentality. For some reason the English produce good youth coaches, but terrible 'Managers'.

Usually by round 4-5 you can work out what's the go, it's taken me this long, I reckon if we make the 6, it's a good year, I predict 6-5.

Edited November 26, 2017 by moops

[Jestr]

On 25/11/2017 at 7:25 AM, mjake1234 said:

Stick around. With these performances attendances will only get worse. Not only only are we now not attracting new members but the rusted on brigade is flaking off.

Very true. Our performance was always average at best with very few stand out games in the early days of this club. 

Still, attending games was never an issue. 

Now I find it more like dealing with a magnet in reverse. I try to get closer and love this club but it seams to fight against me doing everything to keep me at a distance. 

 

[silva10]

I haven’t seen the game, so can’t comment on it. However, by the comments on here it seems we were very poor. When Joyce was appointed I was more than a bit surprised. The times I saw the United reserves against our reserves, they were very defensive and the total opposite of how we were playing. It is now beginning to look like a very poor appointment and another complete fuck up by CFG!

[playmaker]

4 hours ago, silva10 said:

defensive and the total opposite of how we were playing

So you want to go back to how we were playing last year?

Please clarify.

[MXG]

It is evident now that the slump has been caused by 2 pests: Valkanis and Cahill. One is sacked the other has been given a second warning.

Nothing to see here any more, move on.

[silva10]

On 11/28/2017 at 11:24 PM, playmaker said:

So you want to go back to how we were playing last year?

Please clarify.

NO!!  I want the team to improve on last year! Isn't that the point of bringing in a new manager?

When CFG bought the club, Sorriano was saying how they wanted to play with a certain style. That style is a possession based attacking style. We have brought in a manger who's style is the very opposite of that. It will be great if it works, but the evidence so far is that the team struggles to score enough goals.

[Shahanga]

The current style is an insomniac’s dream (daydream obviously)

[playmaker]

Just now, silva10 said:

That style is a possession based attacking style.

That is exactly the style we played last year and it didn't work. We have actually had very good open opportunities on goal this season with the style we are playing with a much better defensive structure even though stupid errors have cost us. So I don't know what you are complaining about. 

My only complaint is the critical errors we have made in defence and the easy goals that we have missed but that's a complaint to individual players rather than the tactics Wazza has implemented.

Ultimately I don't care how we play if we get the 3 points but all I remember from last season was that our team was tactical and strategic chaos. At least now we have some organisation. Time will tell I suppose.

[wombegongal]

7 minutes ago, playmaker said:

That is exactly the style we played last year and it didn't work. We have actually had very good open opportunities on goal this season with the style we are playing with a much better defensive structure even though stupid errors have cost us. So I don't know what you are complaining about. 

My only complaint is the critical errors we have made in defence and the easy goals that we have missed but that's a complaint to individual players rather than the tactics Wazza has implemented.

Ultimately I don't care how we play if we get the 3 points but all I remember from last season was that our team was tactical and strategic chaos. At least now we have some organisation. Time will tell I suppose.

I'll paraphrase what you have said, 'we were just unlucky'

[silva10]

7 hours ago, playmaker said:

That is exactly the style we played last year and it didn't work. We have actually had very good open opportunities on goal this season with the style we are playing with a much better defensive structure even though stupid errors have cost us. So I don't know what you are complaining about. 

My only complaint is the critical errors we have made in defence and the easy goals that we have missed but that's a complaint to individual players rather than the tactics Wazza has implemented.

Ultimately I don't care how we play if we get the 3 points but all I remember from last season was that our team was tactical and strategic chaos. At least now we have some organisation. Time will tell I suppose.

I don't have a problem with a manger coming in and trying to solidify our defence. In fact. when Mancini took over from Mark Hughes at Manchester City, he did exactly that. From there he built a successful team. However, he also had us playing on the front foot whenever possible. My concern with Joyce, is that he may be too negative, which is a bit different than being solid defensively. If a team can't hold possession, and be able to attack with confidence when the opportunity presents itself, then no matter how strong they are defensively, they will struggle to win games.

Now I am obviously not a match going fan with Melbourne City, but from afar I just don't see what his tactics are in improving our attacking ability. For me playing Malik in front of Brattan or Kilkenny is very confusing. He has nowhere near the ability of those two. Also, in the last game he played Fitzgerald at right back by what I have read on here. For me he has been one of the best attackers this season.

Like you say, time will tell, but it just looks like another season of upheaval and disappointment at the club, and for that I feel for you fans who have stuck by the club.

 

Edited November 30, 2017 by silva10

[playmaker]

54 minutes ago, wombegongal said:

I'll paraphrase what you have said, 'we were just unlucky'

No far from it. We lost because a player made an error which has nothing to do with luck.

Just now, silva10 said:

I don't have a problem with a manger coming in and trying to solidify our defence. In fact. when Mancini took over from Mark Hughes at Manchester City, he did exactly that. From there he built a successful team. However, he also had us playing on the front foot whenever possible. My concern with Joyce, is that he may be too negative, which is a bit different than being solid defensively. If a team can't hold possession, and be able to attack with confidence when the opportunity presents itself, then no matter how strong they are defensively, they will struggle to win games.

Now I am obviously not a match going fan with Melbourne City, but from afar I just don't see what his tactics are in improving our attacking ability. For me playing Malik in front of Brattan or Kilkenny is very confusing. He has nowhere near the ability of those two. Also, in the last game he played Fitzgerald at right back by what I have read on here. For me he has been one of the best attackers this season.

Like you say, time will tell, but it just looks like another season of upheaval and disappointment at the club, and for that I feel for you fans who have stuck by the club.

 

All you are saying is that you don't like the style of play which is you opinion and you are entitled to it.

The style of play that is being employed is a counter-attacking style which is used around the world in all levels of the game and with great success. But to implement it means that certain foundations need to be laid piece by piece and then integrated together. Hoping for perfection from the onset is not realistic and usual managers take a season to implement their philosophy.

We just have to wait and see how we progress but to suggest we are not improving, taking into account the late signings, injuries to key players and the bad culture at the club, is just not correct.

From a strategic, structural and tactical viewpoint we are already miles ahead from last season, and I think a lower possession defensive counter-attacking style is better suited to the A-League level and I have been saying this for years.

Ultimately it's a numbers game so to be honest, I don't really care how we get the 3 points.

 

Edited December 1, 2017 by playmaker

[jw1739]

I'm always angry when we lose in the way we did against Perth because I thought we looked "soft" in that game. Considering how easily they rolled over us last season, I would have thought that we would not have given that early goal away so easily.

Overall this season there's little doubt in my mind that Joyce's midfield and forward plans were thrown into disarray with Bruno's injury and then the departure of Caceres. It's also clear that there's been some unhelpful behaviour by both Valkanis and a small group of players.

I hope we've addressed what needed to be addressed and that in the rest of the season we are going to be respectably resilient and hard to beat and can score often enough to at least be a genuine threat to all the other teams.

[MXG]

13 hours ago, silva10 said:

NO!!  I want the team to improve on last year! Isn't that the point of bringing in a new manager?

When CFG bought the club, Sorriano was saying how they wanted to play with a certain style. That style is a possession based attacking style. We have brought in a manger who's style is the very opposite of that. It will be great if it works, but the evidence so far is that the team struggles to score enough goals.

I bet most of our fans would like to see possession based beautiful Dutch football. I personally could not simply convince myself to support Victory for many years because of the way they played. Supporting Heart was no brainier.

Heart and City tried to develop that style for years. But the reality is that Australia with salary cap will never get players skillful enough to play possession football on regular basis. And I am glad that CFG recognized this finally. With all my respect to Bruno and others, marquees in Au are simply rejects from Eu or even MSL.

As for Wazza, our first 3 matches were the best games we've had in a while. Defending in a pack, pressing opponents high. Unfortunately, that did not last long. And I blame players and Valkanis, not Wazza.

I would say after Valkanis departure, it is time for Wazza to show what he is capable (or not capable) to do.

[Dylan]

10 minutes ago, MXG said:

I bet most of our fans would like to see possession based beautiful Dutch football. I personally could not simply convince myself to support Victory for many years because of the way they played. Supporting Heart was no brainier.

Heart and City tried to develop that style for years. But the reality is that Australia with salary cap will never get players skillful enough to play possession football on regular basis. And I am glad that CFG recognized this finally. With all my respect to Bruno and others, marquees in Au are simply rejects from Eu or even MSL.

As for Wazza, our first 3 matches were the best games we've had in a while. Defending in a pack, pressing opponents high. Unfortunately, that did not last long. And I blame players and Valkanis, not Wazza.

I would say after Valkanis departure, it is time for Wazza to show what he is capable (or not capable) to do.

Brisbane? Adelaide ?  Plus to say the first three games were 'the best' we have had in a while is deluded

 

[Shahanga]

10 hours ago, playmaker said:

No far from it. We lost because a player made an error which has nothing to do with luck.

All you are saying is that you don't like the style of play which is you opinion and you are entitled to it.

The style of play that is being employed is a counter-attacking style which is used around the world in all levels of the game and with great success. But to implement it means that certain foundations need to be laid piece by piece and then integrated together. Hoping for perfection from the onset is not realistic and usual managers take a season to implement their philosophy.

We just have to wait and see how we progress but to suggest we are not improving, taking into account the late signings, injuries to key players and the bad culture at the club, is just not correct.

From a strategic, structural and tactical viewpoint we are already miles ahead from last season, and I think a lower possession defensive counter-attacking style is better suited to the A-League level and I have been saying this for years.

Ultimately it's a numbers game so to be honest, I don't really care how we get the 3 points.

 

I know you like counter attacking and I like possession but forgetting “taste”, I want to challenge you on that the league is better suited to counter attacking football.

The best team by a country mile in the history of the league played possession football.

Edited December 1, 2017 by Shahanga
Auto uncorrect

[MXG]

11 hours ago, Dylan said:

Brisbane? Adelaide ?  Plus to say the first three games were 'the best' we have had in a while is deluded

 

Brisbane is and were always shit. Even with Fat Angie and Gypsy on-board they were shit.

Adelaide is a good example, agree, this is a team I hate least in A-League. They were definitely more successful pushing attractive football than us. But would you prefer long run approach rather than winning a title and then fail next season completely? And in the long run quality possession football is simply not achievable in A-League at least until salary cap is removed. Most successful teams in A-League Sydney and Tards played primitive but efficiently all that time.

As for the first 3 games, the last time we had a good series was the beginning of the last season. But then everybody understood that our success is temporal. This year we saw a newly created system, not an opportunistic 3-defenders adventure.

Look, I am not arguing that Wazza should of sorted out Valcanis earlier. Before the start of the season he said that he has needed 3-4 rounds to fully gel the team. But in fact we ONLY had 3-4 good rounds. Now at least he has no excuses.

[wombegongal]

I think we are looking for coaches in the wrong area. For a long time total football was the attractive possession based approach. But I really feel like their system has been surpassed by the Germans and Spanish systems which are consistently creating better players and coaches. We really should be looking for a young German coach in my opinion they seem to provide aggressive and attractive football that is mishmashed with physical read 'English' football.

[rayv36]

14 hours ago, MXG said:

Brisbane is and were always shit. Even with Fat Angie and Gypsy on-board they were shit.

Incorrect. 

[NewConvert]

5 hours ago, wombegongal said:

I think we are looking for coaches in the wrong area. For a long time total football was the attractive possession based approach. But I really feel like their system has been surpassed by the Germans and Spanish systems which are consistently creating better players and coaches. We really should be looking for a young German coach in my opinion they seem to provide aggressive and attractive football that is mishmashed with physical read 'English' football.

I agree with this. I noticed that British coaches don't travel well with only Merrick being successful in Oz.

[MXG]

On 12/2/2017 at 2:27 PM, rayv36 said:

Incorrect. 

I guess we have different definition of "shit" then. Or you are just giving me your perception as an argument.

Edited December 4, 2017 by MXG