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Warren Joyce. As predicted by Serb Hair Dresser.. Goneski


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9 hours ago, mattyh001 said:

Can't say I've heard much about this bloke until the rumour mill / this forum said he's potentially on his way

If he is coming I have significant doubts, but feel we should reserve judgement and #believe given most of the visa players who CFG has signed have been solid (which says to me the club does vet incoming overseas personnel reasonably well) and that in reality the club has been on the rise under the CFG group for all but the second half of the season just finished.

Given that the same squad who had dropped off so badly last season had won FFA Cup in November and were sitting pretty mid season, IMO the CFG management had reason to show faith in the structure they had.  With hindsight they screwed the pooch, but then again it's always easier to find fault with hindsight.

 

In terms of Warren Joyce

Some Pros:

=> was a hard nut as a player; can't see him being different as a manager - and something that we need

=> was ok when coaching Hull in a time when Hull was a financial mess

=> has coaching pedigree in a Man Utd era under Alex Ferguson

 

Cons:

=> was shite at Wigan. However, it's worth noting that the season before, Wigan had won promotion from League One so you cant really say that the core base was world beating to start with - throw in the financial limitations and Joyce was rather hamstrung

=> hasn't won anything at senior level coaching wise, and has limited experience coaching senior level

=> has no experience with salary cap system or coaching here - will have to adjust

=> brings no marketability with him.  It's more important that he can actually coach by all means (we certainly don't want another bambi) but the club is still trying to win the hearts and minds of Melbourne. That's where a Roy Keane fits better 

 It's a must that we have a capable, hard nosed coach - and he looks to fill that requirement.

However your last point about marketability is also very important. Don't see him doing that for us.

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7 hours ago, wombegongal said:

Right on the money. I think everyone on this forum wants a coach that has won 10 trophies at senior level, is a hard cunt, has a name, has worked in a salary capped league and has had sexy with 25 Cuban virgins at the same time. News flash this magical person doesn't exist. Dumping on a guy and saying it is underwhelming is pretty pointless when I'm pretty sure most people have little to no idea about this guy. But don't let commonsense get in the way of a sad Melbourne city/ heart story.

Honestly we should get a fucking councillor on these forums sometimes. 

then why import a foreign coach at all?

 

if we are going to be a training ground for coaches why not use australian talent instead of wasting one of only 10 senior spots we have?

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8 hours ago, wombegongal said:

Right on the money. I think everyone on this forum wants a coach that has won 10 trophies at senior level, is a hard cunt, has a name, has worked in a salary capped league and has had sexy with 25 Cuban virgins at the same time. News flash this magical person doesn't exist. Dumping on a guy and saying it is underwhelming is pretty pointless when I'm pretty sure most people have little to no idea about this guy. But don't let commonsense get in the way of a sad Melbourne city/ heart story.

Honestly we should get a fucking councillor on these forums sometimes. 

 

Damien Mori, although I don't know about the virgins

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Cant wait for the derby! If he's as hard nosed like everyone is saying (i have no idea) then imagine if shit gets real on the sidelines with Muscat now that would be a nice little derby in itself. 

Is it possible to change the thread name again to "Wazza the hard ass" or something not so negative or am i just to positive for a Heart/City supporter

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2 hours ago, mjake1234 said:

 It's a must that we have a capable, hard nosed coach - and he looks to fill that requirement.

However your last point about marketability is also very important. Don't see him doing that for us.

I can't fathom this "marketability" point at all. I don't think people suddenly jump on board a club simply because it has a "name" as a manager. Didn't work with Aloisi, did it? What counts is results.

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My take is that Joyce is certainly not a sexy or inspiring choice for manager after all of the speculation that has happened. I get people feel underwhelmed, even i am somewhat.

However, firstly and probably most importantly, I'm not going to pretend im an expert on managers in England, and nor do i think any of you here are any better qualified than CFG to make that call either. Being a CFG job, there would have been squillions of applications so if the big bosses think that his application was the best out of all of them then I'll 100% back their judgement and at bare minimum give old mate Wazza a good few months before making my own personal judgement.

Joyce's apprenticeship looks pretty good on paper imo and he's held in high regard at Utd. Id argue if you took the Wigan stint out it all looks pretty good tbh. On the Wigan stint, the arms race that is English football makes his stint hard to judge in my opinion and if you look at the two other managers that took over that side during that season they clearly did no better.

I love the reports coming out that hes a hard but fair cunt, that is exactly what this side needs. The other side of it is that hes more of a pragmatist rather than playing the same old shit every week. IMO that clearly cost us last season as by the time November rolled around everyone had figured us out. A pragmatic coach with a good squad is in extremely good stead in the A League imo, so hopefully CFG's grand plan comes to fruition and we can all sing Wazza's name from the terraces come May.

Edited by bt50
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13 hours ago, mattyh001 said:

Cons:

=> was shite at Wigan. However, it's worth noting that the season before, Wigan had won promotion from League One so you cant really say that the core base was world beating to start with - throw in the financial limitations and Joyce was rather hamstrung

=> hasn't won anything at senior level coaching wise, and has limited experience coaching senior level

=> has no experience with salary cap system or coaching here - will have to adjust

=> brings no marketability with him.  It's more important that he can actually coach by all means (we certainly don't want another bambi) but the club is still trying to win the hearts and minds of Melbourne. That's where a Roy Keane fits better 

 

1 hour ago, jw1739 said:

I can't fathom this "marketability" point at all. I don't think people suddenly jump on board a club simply because it has a "name" as a manager. Didn't work with Aloisi, did it? What counts is results.

Made that point originally, in part because of how shite Bambi was but more so that results are a much more important in keeping people from a long term support perspective. The point was made last of all too; as such it's more of a footnote

That said, my take from posts on the forum re Joyce (of which the posts are mostly views where people barely know who he even is) gives a large indicator that having a well known name can soften negative fan reaction to any appointment.

 

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5 minutes ago, wombegongal said:

This guy has more experience than the Australian talent you are talking about. They have coached in the NPL or as assistants this guy has coached juniors at Man U. The calibre of players is not even fucking comparable. The only thing comparable is the ego of the players and only one group should really have them (and I'll give you the hint it isn't the neo pros in Australia.) So this guy likely ticks the attitude management box with the locker room egos, he has coached players of a higher level and is allegedly a hard cunt. The only thing he seems to be missing is the salary cap thing and the 'big name' which honestly isn't even a thing.

If this guy can hold a clip board and kick some of these players up the arse, we will be a better team than last year. I have no idea how this guy will go, but neither does any person on this forum. As BT mentions above I more or less trust CFG to get it right. I think their track record is pretty good minus JVS (like our visa signings, facilities etc). Anyway enough common sense from me continue the ritual slaughter of the potential new manager.

tell me about his record at wigan and man u.  because from all i know and have found it's pretty poor.

and no.  CFG dont always get it right.  so no i wont just blindly trust their decisions.  they need to be scrutinised and critiqued.  they bought in roy hodgson for fuck sake.  

being english and a 'hard cunt' is not enough and that is all im seeing.

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Warren Joyce set to take over as boss of Melbourne City

Published: 12:52 EDT, 17 June 2017 | Updated: 13:38 EDT, 17 June 2017

Warren Joyce is poised to take over as manager of Melbourne City this week. The 52-year-old former Manchester United coach took a flight on Saturday ahead of finalising terms with the Australian A League side, a partner club of Manchester City.

Joyce retains a reputation as a strong coach despite a disappointing spell at Wigan Athletic where he was given just four months in the job before being sacked by chairman David Sharpe in March, two weeks after Joyce had major eye surgery.

Joyce was instrumental in helping many of United's top youngsters make their breakthrough, including Paul Pogba, and Melbourne are hoping his experience can help accelerate the development of their young players.

Former Manchester United coach Warren Joyce is set for a move to Melbourne City

Former Manchester United coach Warren Joyce is set for a move to Melbourne City

Melbourne are perceived as having a soft underbelly and have so far fallen short of expectations despite substantial investment. 

The City Football Group consulted former England coach Roy Hodgson about changes they should make to their structure and they have identified Joyce as someone with a track record of giving 'tough love' to gain results and add a more hardened approach.

Joyce has never been afraid to give players constructive criticism about their attitude towards training. 

He spoke out last year expressing disappointment at the stagnated careers of his former United charges Adnan Januzaj, Federico Macheda and James Wilson saying: 'The frustrating thing is seeing ones like Januzaj, Wilson or Macheda get up to that level and stop doing the work they did to get them to that level.

Joyce was previously in charge of Wigan Athletic but was sacked after four months at the helm

Joyce was previously in charge of Wigan Athletic but was sacked after four months at the helm

'Not play the games, not train as hard, sit in jacuzzis and not do the same weights and sessions they did to get there. Those are the frustrating ones for me, because that could be avoided.

'You either want to be in a boyband in a pop star environment, or a footballer.' Melbourne saw star midfielder Aaron Mooy join Manchester City last year and he is set to be sold to Huddersfield Town this week for £8m plus £2m in add-ons. City want to include sell-on and buy-back options in the deal. 

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Interesting. Whilst his accomplishments dont jump off the page - he  seemingly will add one thing which we need. Viagra.

It seems the feedback to CFG was spot on - we need to harden the Eff Up - ASAP! 

You dont need the tactical genius of an Italian or Spanish coach for this league - it is a physical league, played in the summer and a limited level of player available.

Hopefully the CEO role is the next to change - need some bloody cialis for that position as well.

Our history as heart and now City can be summed up on one word - meek. Time to get a backbone, on and off the field.

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Well this could be an inspired choice if it means some of our cattle, I'm looking at Brattan, Caceres and Kamau, get a kick up the arse and are shown what it really takes to be a top footballer rather than just ambling across the pitch and picking up the weekly pay packet and acting like a big knob because he's playing for a team associated with ManCity. I've still got bad pictures in my head of Kamau giving up chasing Castro because he thought it was somebody else's job and couldn't give a rats arse :hkpalm:. We know how that ended.

Edited by HEARTinator
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CFG want to develop local talents and repeat Mooy success story. So development coach makes sense. They are after a profit. NYC not to be compared in the same sentance cause of the shire market size. Even though with glamorous setup they haven't got more success.

Sill there a disappointment, what about you and I, our memberships and expectations. CFG don't care about couple thousands more bums on seats and coach marketability. It was said how 100s applications landed in a two days. And now - meh. Other clubs shopped better names, seems to have large budget. Every coach over there is hard nosed - this not an argument. We had expert advise from their top coach Roy during Perth games. It can't be worse then those results. 

His reserves stats, that team with first team dropouts was much stronger that other teams. What can he do against better organised opponents - need to wait round two. 

Top 6 placement is ours...

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2 minutes ago, Imtellingyou said:

CFG want to develop local talents and repeat Mooy success story. So development coach makes sense. They are after a profit. NYC not to be compared in the same sentance cause of the shire market size. Even though with glamorous setup they haven't got more success.

Sill there a disappointment, what about you and I, our memberships and expectations. CFG don't care about couple thousands more bums on seats and coach marketability. It was said how 100s applications landed in a two days. And now - meh. Other clubs shopped better names, seems to have large budget. Every coach over there is hard nosed - this not an argument. We had expert advise from their top coach Roy during Perth games. It can't be worse then those results. 

His reserves stats, that team with first team dropouts was much stronger that other teams. What can he do against better organised opponents - need to wait round two. 

Top 6 placement is ours...

Hi Warren.

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1 hour ago, nah brah said:

tell me about his record at wigan and man u.  because from all i know and have found it's pretty poor.

and no.  CFG dont always get it right.  so no i wont just blindly trust their decisions.  they need to be scrutinised and critiqued.  they bought in roy hodgson for fuck sake.  

being english and a 'hard cunt' is not enough and that is all im seeing.

He had success in 11/12 in the Reserve league. Roy seems to think he is the best man for the job so who are we to argue seeing that his analysis of our club and it's cultural problems were spot on.

And FWIW, Wigan was/is a head case and no manager could have turned that club around in 4 months doesn't matter how good they were.

I am not pro-wazza by any means, it's just that he ticks the boxes and is far better that the rabble we have here, and three year term seems right given this club needs a long-term kick up the arse to ensure a permanent change.

I now look forward to the next season that's for sure.

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35 minutes ago, playmaker said:

He had success in 11/12 in the Reserve league. Roy seems to think he is the best man for the job so who are we to argue seeing that his analysis of our club and it's cultural problems were spot on.

And FWIW, Wigan was/is a head case and no manager could have turned that club around in 4 months doesn't matter how good they were.

I am not pro-wazza by any means, it's just that he ticks the boxes and is far better that the rabble we have here, and three year term seems right given this club needs a long-term kick up the arse to ensure a permanent change.

I now look forward to the next season that's for sure.

success 5 or 6 years ago in a junior league with an overpowered team.  not really inspiring.  at least we can expect the defence to dig in this season.  that will be nice for a change.

 

i do like his quote 'You either want to be in a boyband in a pop star environment, or a footballer.'  pretty funny from a man u coach - particularly one that had pogba.

 

and for the fuck nugget that thinks people are looking for morinho. you are a fuck nugget.

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