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strider    2,394

The age old question: property or stocks?

I don't have significant money for either but assuming you already have a place of residence, would you invest your cash on property or a stock portfolio worth the same amount? 

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bt50    3,235

Imo property is always the best investment to get started. Safe, reliable and even if you do make a loss, its a forced way of saving money.

Im sure there'll be differing opinions, and perhaps in terms of returns theyre spot on, but a beginner in the market cant go too wrong with property.

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CALZALOL    182
2 hours ago, Jimmy said:

Fuck that.

Mining is old news, it's all about agricultural now.

Investors are retreating to gold due to the Economic situation :) 
 

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malloy    3,110
39 minutes ago, CALZALOL said:

Investors are retreating to gold due to the Economic situation :) 
 

Well your tip is off to a fantastic start :up:

Also if things are really bad you actually buy gold or more likely a gold backed ETF, as in tough economic times gold mine companies still carry business risk.

FWIW a few research houses are tipping gold stocks to have a bumper year. So don't be too disheartened.

3 hours ago, strider said:

The age old question: property or stocks?

I don't have significant money for either but assuming you already have a place of residence, would you invest your cash on property or a stock portfolio worth the same amount? 

If you want exposure to property, but don't want significant further debt, you could buy REITs.

If you already have a PPR you could always get an offset account (if you don't already) and put savings into that. Your return is essentially the amount of interest saved on your mortgage. As you earn only nominal income there is no tax and it is as risk free as you will get, which is a big plus with current volatility and the general global economic outlook.

 

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Tesla    8,093

Pros for property :

Government gives you money for your first (is it now only if you build?), considered safe equity that you can always leverage, tax and many other laws work in your favour if your money is in a house (especially if it's primary residence). 

Cons for property:

Huge ass bubble that will collapse at some point in the not to distant future.  Now if you bought today it still might increase in value enough that when the bubble bursts your not really affected  maybe you'd even come on top, but who knows when it will burst. Also property is generally a long term investment so as long as you don't sell when the bubble bursts it won't be an issue. 

 

Personally I am about as risk neutral as it gets, so once the economy starts to look a little less volatile I'm putting all my money in shares and basically treating it as my savings account, but the goal of these savings would be to buy a house. At least that's what I'm thinking now,who knows what will happen especially how the economy is. 

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Tesla    8,093
41 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

Well that went well. 

 

As well as this?

On 04/04/2015 at 3:57 PM, Jimmy said:

This crude oil ETF is my next punt. Seems pretty safe to me. No way oil prices will stay this low.

 

Edited by Tesla

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Jimmy    3,161

Oil prices will rise again. Guaranteed with a finite resource. Just not as quickly as I'd expected. 

Plus they've seemed to have found a floor now. The bounce back probably isn't even that far away. 

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Tesla    8,093
Just now, Jimmy said:

Oil prices will rise again. Guaranteed with a finite resource. Just not as quickly as I'd expected. 

There is no 'guaranteed' in this thread.

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Tesla    8,093
1 minute ago, CALZALOL said:

:)

Screenshot_1.jpg

Not bad, but I probably made more gambling in that same time period that you did from these shares, and the way the market is currently I dare say gambling is less risky.

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CALZALOL    182
1 minute ago, Tesla said:

Not bad, but I probably made more gambling in that same time period that you did from these shares, and the way the market is currently I dare say gambling is less risky.

I agree 100% with that

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Tesla    8,093
1 minute ago, malloy said:

It should be up higher

Hmm, you're right. I assumed it would have been smashed like everything else today but it is doing well.

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malloy    3,110
5 minutes ago, Tesla said:

Hmm, you're right. I assumed it would have been smashed like everything else today but it is doing well.

Nah I would be expecting gold and gold stocks to be going up in times of uncertainty and fear.

As I posted earlier gold stocks are expected to perform well this year.

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Tesla    8,093
29 minutes ago, malloy said:

Nah I would be expecting gold and gold stocks to be going up in times of uncertainty and fear.

As I posted earlier gold stocks are expected to perform well this year.

Lol I forgot newcrest is gold :droy:

Might as well just buy gold directly if that's the reason for buying newcrest.

By 'directly' I mean either a ETF or futures etc.

I don't think there is an Australian one but there isn't any additional exchange rate risk than if there was an Australian one. Though if you compare to something like newcrest they probably have hedging in place so they likely should have less exchange rate risk.

But they'd also have hedging in place for the gold price as well, so won't be affected by the gold price movements as much in the short term, hence why an ETF or futures would be better if you want to bet on the gold price increasing.

You're also exposing yourself to firm specific risks. 

Edited by Tesla

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Tesla    8,093
46 minutes ago, CALZALOL said:

Yeah NCM still heading up

Australian listed Gold ETF's are: 
QAU (Betashares)
GOLD (ETF Securities)
ZGOL (ANZ)

They don't seem to have much liquidity.

Also NCM seems to be up more which is unusual, I assume they have long term contracts at a specific price so fluctuations shouldn't affect them as much. Have you looked into that calzalol? Interested to know why they're up more than the ETFs. Maybe cause the AUD has fallen a bit as well, and they might not hedge currency.

Edited by Tesla

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malloy    3,110
2 hours ago, Tesla said:

They don't seem to have much liquidity.

Also NCM seems to be up more which is unusual, I assume they have long term contracts at a specific price so fluctuations shouldn't affect them as much. Have you looked into that calzalol? Interested to know why they're up more than the ETFs. Maybe cause the AUD has fallen a bit as well, and they might not hedge currency.

NCM had a massive day.

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CALZALOL    182
7 hours ago, Tesla said:

They don't seem to have much liquidity.

Also NCM seems to be up more which is unusual, I assume they have long term contracts at a specific price so fluctuations shouldn't affect them as much. Have you looked into that calzalol? Interested to know why they're up more than the ETFs. Maybe cause the AUD has fallen a bit as well, and they might not hedge currency.

From memory they were unhedged completely, however don't quote me on that just yet. I will look to find where I read that on the website and edit this post.

EDIT
Found it in the Company Summary section: http://www.newcrest.com.au/investors/company-summary
Final paragraph, "As an unhedged gold producer ..."

Edited by CALZALOL
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Tesla    8,093
28 minutes ago, CALZALOL said:

From memory they were unhedged completely, however don't quote me on that just yet. I will look to find where I read that on the website and edit this post.

EDIT
Found it in the Company Summary section: http://www.newcrest.com.au/investors/company-summary
Final paragraph, "As an unhedged gold producer ..."

Interesting... 

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CALZALOL    182
12 minutes ago, Tesla said:

Interesting... 

I see this in both positive and negative lights, as it can increase shareholder returns but leaves no protection for currency fluctuations. So I definitely can understand why you would say 'interesting', however with the weak AUD I see no problem(s) in the short-medium term.

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Tesla    8,093
8 minutes ago, CALZALOL said:

I see this in both positive and negative lights, as it can increase shareholder returns but leaves no protection for currency fluctuations. So I definitely can understand why you would say 'interesting', however with the weak AUD I see no problem(s) in the short-medium term.

The bigger issuing is the gold price rather than currency. Their debt is probably in USD and gold is sold in USD, so they have a "natural hedge" on the currency anyway.

I looked up why they don't hedge the gold price, and it goes back to when gold price was booming around GFC time they decided to close out their hedgebook at a fairly large cost. Of course no one has an issue with it when gold is higher but then gold prices shrank for a while and there was pressure on them to start hedging again but they didn't. Now obviously they'll reap the rewards of higher gold prices.

But there are a couple of reasons for not hedging it, one is simply that investors can hedge their own risk better than the company, and that's not a bad position for a public company to take. But also, and this is probably the bigger reason, when prices are low they can switch to a different grade of gold to maintain their profit margins, and when prices are higher they can produce a grade of gold that is otherwise not economical to produce. That flexibility allows them to absorb lower gold prices pretty well if gold prices were to fall.

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Shahanga    3,497
7 hours ago, CALZALOL said:

From memory they were unhedged completely, however don't quote me on that just yet. I will look to find where I read that on the website and edit this post.

EDIT
Found it in the Company Summary section: http://www.newcrest.com.au/investors/company-summary
Final paragraph, "As an unhedged gold producer ..."

You bought them and were recommending them without knowing what their hedging was?

OK.

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CALZALOL    182
2 hours ago, Shahanga said:

You bought them and were recommending them without knowing what their hedging was?

OK.

After being at school and work until 11 last night, I was not confident in giving the answer to Tesla so wanted to double check
However as you can see from my post, at the very start of the post I stated that from memory they were completely unhedged. 

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Shahanga    3,497
11 hours ago, CALZALOL said:

After being at school and work until 11 last night, I was not confident in giving the answer to Tesla so wanted to double check
However as you can see from my post, at the very start of the post I stated that from memory they were completely unhedged. 

You are at school, working P/T and following and investing in the stock market?

Bloody hell that's impressive.

 

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strider    2,394

CBA is down to the 70s, usually has a good run in the 90s and is looking to go upward. 

Dividends are life

8 hours ago, Shahanga said:

You are at school, working P/T and following and investing in the stock market?

Bloody hell that's impressive.

 

When I was at school my main concern was when I had private time to wack the meat 

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CALZALOL    182

MXC - MGC PHARMACEUTICALS
Medicinal Cannabis company.
Up 30% in 2 Days
Recent legislative change in Victoria makes this a lucrative stock

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Jimmy    3,161
23 hours ago, CALZALOL said:

MXC - MGC PHARMACEUTICALS
Medicinal Cannabis company.
Up 30% in 2 Days
Recent legislative change in Victoria makes this a lucrative stock

"Medical" Marijuana could become a huge industry here if we follow in the US footsteps. I can see it going that way as well just because Governments will see the huge tax revenue opportunities, at the moment the change in legislation seems to be aimed at helping out people who logically need it. ie. Kids with seizures and shit. But if we somehow go down the US route of walking into the doctors office with a sore back and walking out with a 10kg bag of weed you'll be balling.

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KSK_47    5,475
17 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

"Medical" Marijuana could become a huge industry here if we follow in the US footsteps. I can see it going that way as well just because Governments will see the huge tax revenue opportunities, at the moment the change in legislation seems to be aimed at helping out people who logically need it. ie. Kids with seizures and shit. But if we somehow go down the US route of walking into the doctors office with a sore back and walking out with a 10kg bag of weed you'll be balling.

Totally going to be me

kEAk2Uu.jpg

 

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Tesla    8,093
2 hours ago, Jimmy said:

"Medical" Marijuana could become a huge industry here if we follow in the US footsteps. I can see it going that way as well just because Governments will see the huge tax revenue opportunities, at the moment the change in legislation seems to be aimed at helping out people who logically need it. ie. Kids with seizures and shit. But if we somehow go down the US route of walking into the doctors office with a sore back and walking out with a 10kg bag of weed you'll be balling.

It's bigger than that, it will eventually be legal for recreational use, and these same companies will be the ones ready to pounce.

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15 minutes ago, Tesla said:

It's bigger than that, it will eventually be legal for recreational use, and these same companies will be the ones ready to pounce.

I can't wait for the day I can buy quality weed as easily as I buy alcohol 

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Jimmy    3,161
48 minutes ago, Tesla said:

It's bigger than that, it will eventually be legal for recreational use, and these same companies will be the ones ready to pounce.

Agree completely. Just not sure how far away that is here in Australia. Personally can see Medical Marijuana being legal in all states (I know it's already legal at federal level) in the next 24 months.

Recreational Weed is probably 10+ years away.

Edited by Jimmy

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Jimmy    3,161

Might actually buy like 50,000 shares @CALZALOL. The buyer-seller ratio is insane. Looks like a good short term play as I don't think the SP has found a short term peak yet.

Even if I get rolled I'll probably just hold LT if I like what I see after I finish reading their last few ANNs and Annual Reports. It's a good industry to be in LT.

Cheers for posting it.

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Tesla    8,093

Honestly I wouldn't touch anything with the complete instability of the world economy right now.

I still maintain that gambling is both a less risky and more profitable investment currently.

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Jimmy    3,161
4 hours ago, Tesla said:

Honestly I wouldn't touch anything with the complete instability of the world economy right now.

I still maintain that gambling is both a less risky and more profitable investment currently.

I'm having fun and will continue to do so untill the ass falls out and I'm asking @KD. for a job at the fish and chip shop.

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Jimmy    3,161

Done my research. Professional and ambitious company. Not much there but ideas and a few partnerships but looks promising. Will be taking out a medium-long term holding on Monday in the hope that the various state governments legalize Marijuana for a wide range of medical uses sooner rather than later.

This is unless I get a nice juicy short term spike. Then I'll sell and load up again when the inevitable capital raising happens to fund their operations.

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CALZALOL    182
On 4/16/2016 at 2:58 PM, Jimmy said:

Might actually buy like 50,000 shares @CALZALOL. The buyer-seller ratio is insane. Looks like a good short term play as I don't think the SP has found a short term peak yet.

Even if I get rolled I'll probably just hold LT if I like what I see after I finish reading their last few ANNs and Annual Reports. It's a good industry to be in LT.

Cheers for posting it.

Watch Monday open, buyer-seller ratio. Open has gone crazy when I have been paying attention (buy orders @ $0.05/share when market price is $0.03~/share)

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