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Torn Asunder

City Football Group (CFG) [Owner of Melbourne City]

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Torn Asunder    1,304

I was chatting to a fella today who works at an AFL club.

He mentioned that he was recently a guest of CFG over in Manchester and was considerably impressed with the whole setup, and particularly the new Manchester facilities. Apparently his access into CFG's runnings was facilitated by Simon Pearce, and he said that he was well looked after.

Maybe CFG will start poaching talent from the AFL?

Interestingly he also mentioned that he has started to get into soccer and is now a City member. He loves the atmosphere and the access fans get to players after games. Also, he thinks that the AFL is genuinely quaking in their boots with regard to the growing popularity of soccer.

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M13    197

How come every Tom, Dick and Harry in Australia seems to have access to a senior CFG board member like Pearce?... :blink:
As I recall it I have never even seen more than two CFG board members since 2008.

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Heart_fan    192

CFG seem all too willing to open their doors to anyone, including a delegation from the WSW's apparently on a fact finding mission about their own planned facilities.

Seems odd that they are so open to sharing their IP, ideas and other areas that would likely be best kept secret from the competition.

Oh well, they must have their reasons.

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Tesla    8,058

CFG seem all too willing to open their doors to anyone, including a delegation from the WSW's apparently on a fact finding mission about their own planned facilities.

Seems odd that they are so open to sharing their IP, ideas and other areas that would likely be best kept secret from the competition.

Oh well, they must have their reasons.

It's called networking mate.

Let them look at some facilities, what does it cost them?

Meanwhile they're building a relationship with West Sydney which will help them in the ongoing war with the FFA. We're seeing club owners really pushing on a few issues and getting their way recently, and it seems we're always one of the prime agitators.

Honestly about time the FFA gave up control of the A-League and made it independent like pretty much every other half decent league in the world.

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jw1739    6,762

 

CFG seem all too willing to open their doors to anyone, including a delegation from the WSW's apparently on a fact finding mission about their own planned facilities.

Seems odd that they are so open to sharing their IP, ideas and other areas that would likely be best kept secret from the competition.

Oh well, they must have their reasons.

It's called networking mate.

Let them look at some facilities, what does it cost them?

Meanwhile they're building a relationship with West Sydney which will help them in the ongoing war with the FFA. We're seeing club owners really pushing on a few issues and getting their way recently, and it seems we're always one of the prime agitators.

Honestly about time the FFA gave up control of the A-League and made it independent like pretty much every other half decent league in the world.

No question that you're correct on both of those points. In 14 months CFG have put $27m plus into Melbourne City, and both internally and externally they want to see some return on that.

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Dylan    3,936

CFG seem all too willing to open their doors to anyone, including a delegation from the WSW's apparently on a fact finding mission about their own planned facilities.

Seems odd that they are so open to sharing their IP, ideas and other areas that would likely be best kept secret from the competition.

Oh well, they must have their reasons.

It's called networking mate.

Let them look at some facilities, what does it cost them?

Meanwhile they're building a relationship with West Sydney which will help them in the ongoing war with the FFA. We're seeing club owners really pushing on a few issues and getting their way recently, and it seems we're always one of the prime agitators.

Honestly about time the FFA gave up control of the A-League and made it independent like pretty much every other half decent league in the world.

Might be something might be nothing. But on twitter the Aleague account has been advertising its merch store which doesnt stock any of ours. I asked why and got a reply from City that they have 'centralized' all our merh to the club store. So that suggest they are definitely agitating for more independence.

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Heart_fan    192

Given CFG have allegedly been leading the fight for expansion of the HAL into South East Asian markets, with clubs based in Singapore or Indonesia, one wonders where the common sense in their decision making is.

Of course it's a play for a bigger market, increasing the value of the investment, but just how this would be considered practical is a head scratcher.

Longer travel times, added costs and any other required practicalities just don't seem to stack up in trying this. Even the NBL tried this strategy and it lasted a very short time as it just was not something that played out as expected.

Might seem great on paper, but that's as far as this proposal should go.

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Tesla    8,058

Given CFG have allegedly been leading the fight for expansion of the HAL into South East Asian markets, with clubs based in Singapore or Indonesia, one wonders where the common sense in their decision making is.

Of course it's a play for a bigger market, increasing the value of the investment, but just how this would be considered practical is a head scratcher.

Longer travel times, added costs and any other required practicalities just don't seem to stack up in trying this. Even the NBL tried this strategy and it lasted a very short time as it just was not something that played out as expected.

Might seem great on paper, but that's as far as this proposal should go.

Disagree.

First of all, saying the NBL tried it and failed means nothing, everything the NBL has ever done failed.

IMO Singapore is the most viable one, and we've seen how crazy they are for soccer, and we've seen there are potentially some talented players there. The additional revenue that would come from being in a new market like Singapore would more than offset any additional travel costs. It's also worth noting that the distance between Singapore and Perth is less than Wellington and Perth. It's really not that bad.

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Heart_fan    192

Given CFG have allegedly been leading the fight for expansion of the HAL into South East Asian markets, with clubs based in Singapore or Indonesia, one wonders where the common sense in their decision making is.

Of course it's a play for a bigger market, increasing the value of the investment, but just how this would be considered practical is a head scratcher.

Longer travel times, added costs and any other required practicalities just don't seem to stack up in trying this. Even the NBL tried this strategy and it lasted a very short time as it just was not something that played out as expected.

Might seem great on paper, but that's as far as this proposal should go.

Disagree.

First of all, saying the NBL tried it and failed means nothing, everything the NBL has ever done failed.

IMO Singapore is the most viable one, and we've seen how crazy they are for soccer, and we've seen there are potentially some talented players there. The additional revenue that would come from being in a new market like Singapore would more than offset any additional travel costs. It's also worth noting that the distance between Singapore and Perth is less than Wellington and Perth. It's really not that bad. For the majority of teams in this league Singapore are a 7-8+ hours flight each way. Perth is the outlier really, as it is the only city that would not really have a huge effect on.

You may well disagree about my NBL reference, but one of the main issues that were raised about the club ceasing to exist was travel time and costs. International travel is substantially more expensive over that distance.

Practicalities of doing this week in, week out for a whole season will be a huge challenge, especially for the players based in the Asian based clubs. This is something that Perth and Wellington players have raised in the past also, which should raise some red flags around attempting this on an even greater scale.

The commercial benefits are the huge plus to a few owners, but I am not sure enough thought has gone into it. Getting blinded by the commercial element above all else is enough of a justification for the FFA to put up the stop sign to the clubs trying to push for this.

Let's try and get football continuing to grow here first before trying to take on an even greater challenge and the risk that comes with. There's a lot more work we can do already that many of these owners still haven't seemed to grasp yet.

Edited by Heart_fan

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M13    197

Given CFG have allegedly been leading the fight for expansion of the HAL into South East Asian markets, with clubs based in Singapore or Indonesia, one wonders where the common sense in their decision making is.

Of course it's a play for a bigger market, increasing the value of the investment, but just how this would be considered practical is a head scratcher.

Longer travel times, added costs and any other required practicalities just don't seem to stack up in trying this. Even the NBL tried this strategy and it lasted a very short time as it just was not something that played out as expected.

Might seem great on paper, but that's as far as this proposal should go.

 

They have?...

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Heart_fan    192

 

Given CFG have allegedly been leading the fight for expansion of the HAL into South East Asian markets, with clubs based in Singapore or Indonesia, one wonders where the common sense in their decision making is.

Of course it's a play for a bigger market, increasing the value of the investment, but just how this would be considered practical is a head scratcher.

Longer travel times, added costs and any other required practicalities just don't seem to stack up in trying this. Even the NBL tried this strategy and it lasted a very short time as it just was not something that played out as expected.

Might seem great on paper, but that's as far as this proposal should go.

 

They have?...

 

 

Apparently so....

 

http://www.watoday.com.au/sport/soccer/why-aleague-club-bosses-must-concentrate-on-growing-the-game-inside-australia-20150329-1ma7cp.html

Edited by Heart_fan

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Kinnibari    422

I think it's a bad idea, it might help the CFC's SE Asian profile but the logistics will be a nightmare and if the ratings are consistently down for clubs playing Wellington compared to playing other clubs, how bad would they be for clubs from Indonesia? And it trashes our national league because they'd be replacing it with this league. Not content with changing our club's identity, they're after the while bloody league.

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jw1739    6,762

 

Given CFG have allegedly been leading the fight for expansion of the HAL into South East Asian markets, with clubs based in Singapore or Indonesia, one wonders where the common sense in their decision making is.

Of course it's a play for a bigger market, increasing the value of the investment, but just how this would be considered practical is a head scratcher.

Longer travel times, added costs and any other required practicalities just don't seem to stack up in trying this. Even the NBL tried this strategy and it lasted a very short time as it just was not something that played out as expected.

Might seem great on paper, but that's as far as this proposal should go.

Disagree.

First of all, saying the NBL tried it and failed means nothing, everything the NBL has ever done failed.

IMO Singapore is the most viable one, and we've seen how crazy they are for soccer, and we've seen there are potentially some talented players there. The additional revenue that would come from being in a new market like Singapore would more than offset any additional travel costs. It's also worth noting that the distance between Singapore and Perth is less than Wellington and Perth. It's really not that bad.

I disagree too. At the very least the idea should be discussed before it's thrown out. Those who say that we should grow the league in Australia first need to say where they think that growth is going to come from. The last I heard was that FFA wants two more clubs, one each in Sydney and Melbourne. Given the struggle that Heart/City has to draw even 10,000 to a regular match I can't see that another club in Melbourne is a sensible idea. And please forget planting an A-League club in some regional area - it will not be sustainable.

 

CFG has a global vision and it is going to keep the pressure on FFA to take their heavy hands off the football brake in this country. Good on 'em.

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Peter    725

Before any move towards Asia, CFG should take note of Vincent Tan's idea for Cardiff and ensure that the red of our colour scheme is predominate.

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Imperial Pints    398

The MC sucks balls. The best half time entertainment would consist of him being ceremonially stoned by all the ball kids & competition winners. He is such a flog.

#cfg sack the mc

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SF33    602

The MC sucks balls. The best half time entertainment would consist of him being ceremonially stoned by all the ball kids & competition winners. He is such a flog.

#cfg sack the mc

 

It's a pretty thankless task. Short of doing something like poaching John Mason from the Detroit Pistons, I can't imagine that they'd get anyone that I'd actually be entertained/fired up by.

 

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Shahanga    3,374

I thought Bolton was doing it now?

Anyway that other bloke lost me the day he announced that Birighitti was starting up front for Newcastle. I don't care what your background is do your research. Completely unprofessional. Not sure why he wasn't sacked TBH.

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jw1739    6,762

 

Can't understand how anyone thought this was a reasonable idea in the first place. 

My gut feel is that the overseas owners don't see the league as actually going anywhere at the moment, and they're looking around for ideas to give it a higher profile. Let's face it, during our season it doesn't create much of a buzz, and it then (if you finish bottom four) it disappears for 6 months. Of course there are reasons for this, but I can understand that some owners might be a bit restless.

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Tesla    8,058

Need more clubs, they have to come from somewhere. Apart from Canberra, Wollongong, and a 2nd Brisbane team, things get tricky. Maybe a 3rd Sydney team. Still not enough. Need to go to Auckland and need to go to at least Singapore.

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n i k o    4,671

The problems with the current set up of the league is it must be improved before looking at expanding. Poor refereeing decisions, the salary cap increased and also the number of marquees must be looked at. Because in its current form the league is an unfinished project and lacks the polish to make it bigger. We see dwindling crowd figures each week with many fixtures so until the current league is grown within itself I fail to see any point in continuing to dilute the league with more teams.

Edited by n i k o
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NewConvert    701

I do agree that the A-League needs to improve refereeing, grounds and club infrastructure but the A-League also has to tie in the number of clubs to the multimedia rights as well. Hence expansion teams are likely to coincide with the new multimedia rights agreements. Reality is that the FFA can use the new multimedia deals to fix the stuff just mentioned or include a new clubs (maybe two) or both. If the FFA includes a Singaporean club then the FFA does not have to do much but if they also include a local club I would rather that they follow the WSW model: the FFA funds and creates the club and then is sold as an on-going concern. The cost of providing better infrastructure will not be cheap either.

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Deeming    579

A greater emphasis on the Asian Cup should be the focus if wanting to expand into Asia.

Another option base a Singapore owned team in Darwin build a small ground ~7k.
Darwin is one  hour ahead of them in time zone - broadcast into Singapore.

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Tesla    8,058

The problems with the current set up of the league is it must be improved before looking at expanding. Poor refereeing decisions, the salary cap increased and also the number of marquees must be looked at. Because in its current form the league is an unfinished project and lacks the polish to make it bigger. We see dwindling crowd figures each week with many fixtures so until the current league is grown within itself I fail to see any point in continuing to dilute the league with more teams.

While I'm all for getting rid of or increasing the salary cap, I don't see why the salary cap is an argument against expansion. If anything expansion decreases the need for the salary cap to be increased as the talent is diluted. It also creates more marquee spots. Refereeing will only improve once we have professional referees, and that's exactly why we need to pursue new commercial opportunities, such as Singapore, to bring in the money to make referees professional. I'd also argue more teams and games makes the idea of professional referees more viable. When you only have 135 games a year plus finals, there really isn't much scope for fully pro refs. Add 2 teams and that becomes 198 plus finals. Dwindling crowd figures also highlights the need to exploit new markets and attract new people to the league.

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A greater emphasis on the Asian Cup should be the focus if wanting to expand into Asia.

Another option base a Singapore owned team in Darwin build a small ground ~7k.

Darwin is one  hour ahead of them in time zone - broadcast into Singapore.

How good would their march be every week, march to Changi, onto the plane, off the plane, to the ground.

But seriously up there as the worst idea I've ever heard.

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Tesla    8,058

One issue with the whole thing though, currently NZ players count as foreigners for all teams except Wellington. This gives Wellington the advantage of being able to have Australians and Kiwis not take up visa spots. This situation really need to be resolved by letting all clubs have New Zealanders not count towards their visa player limit. The same would have to apply to Singaporean players if we had a team from there. I understand the argument will then be about Singaporean players taking up game time that could go to young Australian players, but I think the amount of new game time for players your creating will be more than what any Singaporean players will take up, in other word the net effect is more game time for Australian players.

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Moraiwe    88

Dwindling crowd figures also highlights the need to exploit new markets and attract new people to the league.

Is dwindling crowd figures an actuality? Even with Heart's shitty record, crowd and membership numbers kept increasing. Which teams are going backwards?

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Tesla    8,058

Dwindling crowd figures also highlights the need to exploit new markets and attract new people to the league.

Is dwindling crowd figures an actuality? Even with Heart's shitty record, crowd and membership numbers kept increasing. Which teams are going backwards?

No idea, just going off what niko said.

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Deeming    579

 

A greater emphasis on the Asian Cup should be the focus if wanting to expand into Asia.

Another option base a Singapore owned team in Darwin build a small ground ~7k.

Darwin is one  hour ahead of them in time zone - broadcast into Singapore.

How good would their march be every week, march to Changi, onto the plane, off the plane, to the ground.

But seriously up there as the worst idea I've ever heard.

 

You wouldn't need a physical crowd. That's the point.

5.5 million in Singapore ripe for TV viewing. Money is not made on crowd attendance (unless its massive). It is made on TV rights and licencing of goods.

 

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KSK_47    5,406

Another option base a Singapore owned team in Darwin build a small ground ~7k.

Darwin is one  hour ahead of them in time zone - broadcast into Singapore.

 

That spot is reserved for Olympic mate! 

Edited by KSK_47

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SF33    602

I'd like the A-League and FFA (if it continues to run the A-League) to ensure that the infrastructure is in place at every team in a critical market (including a team like Newcastle and, to a lesser extent, Central Coast) to allow those clubs to continue to develop and grow for years to come before worrying about more genuine overseas expansion. If we really must expand the comp, I wouldn't be looking too far from the teams that we've got now, personally (another NZ team, possibly Wollongong, Hobart, if it would be sustainable, Geelong and second Brisbane/Perth team would be the areas that I'd look at).

 

Obviously, as Tesla has mentioned, allowing NZ natives to play at any club without being considered visas is a no-brainer and it's ridiculous that it's not already a rule.

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hedaik    2,594

A greater emphasis on the Asian Cup should be the focus if wanting to expand into Asia.

Another option base a Singapore owned team in Darwin build a small ground ~7k.

Darwin is one hour ahead of them in time zone - broadcast into Singapore.

Great cultural match also

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jw1739    6,762

I'm not sure that FFA has even worked out how many clubs/franchises it sees as the ultimate target for the league. That's the first step, even before you work out how you can reach that target.

 

IMO the league does need more clubs to keep the interest in it up. Let's face it, it's hard to get enthusiastic when the next match is the third time you'll play Central Coast or Newcastle in a season. And that lack of enthusiasm filters its way to potential investors and sponsors, so it's a circular situation.

 

IMO we should be aiming for 14 or 16 clubs. A whole lot of other parameters also need to be reviewed as already mentioned - salary cap, squad numbers, foreign players etc. etc. ATM the way it is the league risks becoming sterile.

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